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Bikes, Pictures, Stories & more => Chat, Offtopic, Meetings & Everything Else => Topic started by: Simon59 on 12.01. 2018 09:02

Title: Tooling Up
Post by: Simon59 on 12.01. 2018 09:02
This might be a bit lazy of me, but I’m sure you guys can give me good and quick advice. My 1954 plunger framed A10 arrives on Monday and me and my garage are ready for her arrival. However, most of my tools are now metric, (but a hammer is still a hammer!), as my last bike was a Hinkley Bonnie, (sorry!) which a young lady in a daydream wrote off for me. Whilst I relish the strip-down to come, I would like to get a good set of spanners before I start and wondered if you could recommend a decent manufacturer/supplier and which common threads and sizes I need. I normally favour open ended ring spanners and a decent socket set as well as the usual adjustables, screwdrivers, etc. Thanks in advance, Simon
Title: Re: Tooling Up
Post by: Greybeard on 12.01. 2018 09:42
You are going to need a fairly limited range of Imperial tools. The only really large spanners you'll need are for the rear axle, (see below). I often see good quality imperial tools in our local recycling centres and boot sales.
Title: Re: Tooling Up
Post by: KiwiGF on 12.01. 2018 09:52
You will need a set of whitworth sized spanners, whitworth sockets to a lesser extent, plus a limited size spare set to carry around with you!

In nz it’s best to get used ones of a known brand, in the uk you might be able to buy new.

If you have AF and metric spanners and sockets you will generally have something that nearly fits, but given you are dealing with 70 year old nuts and bolts usually rounded off you are best off having whitworth.

Most common sizes whitworth on the bikes are 3/16 to 3/8 but the more sizes you have the better  ;)



Title: Re: Tooling Up
Post by: Rex on 12.01. 2018 10:21
Car boots are good for old quality tools in Imperial sizes (NOT Whitworth, which is a thread form) if you have the time to go around them, otherwise Ebay usually has a selection.
I'd stay away from  "nearly fits" like AF/metric and shifters as  they're going to Mueller original nuts, and slip if the nut has already seen Mr Bodge before.
Rooting through a toolbox looking for something which nearly fits is just painful, especially when new sets of Imperial spanners etc are so cheap.
Title: Re: Tooling Up
Post by: cyclobutch on 12.01. 2018 10:24
My bike has screw/bolt heads that no spanner will fit.

But yeah - BSF/BSW and if you can get sockets in those sizes, Imperial AF, BA. Set of magneto spanners?
Title: Re: Tooling Up
Post by: duTch on 12.01. 2018 10:49
 
Quote
....(but a hammer is still a hammer!),...

 A10lb lump hammer is not metric,  neither is a 2oz ball pein.... ;)

 As noted above,  *most* engine/frame fixings are 1/4" & 5/16" Whitworth (equivalent sizes in BS),  which is worth having a thin wall ring spanner with these on each end for barrel stud nuts and some other thing.
 Rocker boxes, sump plate and gearbox/tranny outer cover nuts are 3/16" WW and there's something that is 1/8" ww. I findfe for sizes in sockets and the rest in ring/O-ender  get me by...
 All cycle fixture threads are fairly much BSC or combo BSC/WW threads, Maggie and dynamo stuff is BSF or BA, and most electrical stuff (light fittings) is also BA.
 If you find any other BSF or UNF or metric, it's not standard (as mine is not)....except the Speedo is metric based.

  Sorry, I  didn't mean to get carried away

 Ahem- rounded up x 2
Title: Re: Tooling Up
Post by: Greybeard on 12.01. 2018 11:35
A10lb lump hammer is not metric,  neither is a 2oz ball pein.... ;)

True, you should really get 4.53592 Kg Lump and 56.699 Gm ball pein hammers before striking anything metric.
Title: Re: Tooling Up
Post by: Greybeard on 12.01. 2018 11:55
Because a neighbor gave me some boxes of new metric screws washers and standard and nylock nuts, (6mm?) I have used them for some through fixings, such as mudguard stays so my bike toolkit has a couple of short 13mm ring spanners.  *shh*

The back axle needs a couple of large spanners to avoid damage to the heads: 3/4"W, 7/8"BS and 5/8"W, 11/16"BS. I've attached a picture of my large King Dick for your enjoyment!  :D

Although I've a lot of old tools I could not seem to get a good fit to the crankshaft oil pump worm drive nut. Anyone know about this size?  *work*
Title: Re: Tooling Up
Post by: chaterlea25 on 12.01. 2018 12:06
Hi GB,
Quote
Anyone know about this size?  *work*

Its umpteen sixtyfourths *grins* *grins*

Seriuously though, this has come up several times before,
The best fit I have found is 20mm  *eek*

John
Title: Re: Tooling Up
Post by: RoyC on 12.01. 2018 12:27
I found box spanners very usful at times where a socket is too short, like the large nut holding the front brake plate on.
Title: Re: Tooling Up
Post by: Black Sheep on 12.01. 2018 14:38
eBay lists plenty of whitworth/BSF spanners. Gordon brand spanners are fairly slim - useful for getting to fiddly bits. Some 3/8" drive whitworth sockets are useful for such things as cylinder head bolts. I would also suggest a BAHCO slim adjustable spanner. More useful than you might imagine. A large tub of patience also helps. 
Title: Re: Tooling Up
Post by: scotty on 12.01. 2018 15:40
The funky wrenches and sockets are a must have

Also consider some of the BSA Factory Service tools for dismantling or assembling specific parts.

You can still buy these service tools and some clever bar stewards on this forum have fashioned some of these  tools on their own from other materials.

I've attached BSA service sheet 771 that lists these tools and which model BSA the tools are used on.


HTH

S
Title: Re: Tooling Up
Post by: A10 JWO on 12.01. 2018 16:21
I got a complete set of sockets at a jumble, I had to sort them out as there were hundreds, all ten pence each. This was at Whitewebbs Museum in Enfield.
Title: Re: Tooling Up
Post by: morris on 12.01. 2018 19:45
A set of King Dick double ended WW spanners and a set of King Dick WW sockets 3/8 square.
Still have to encounter a nut or bolt I couldn't undo with these.
Incredibly good fit & quality and a pleasure to work with.
http://www.kingdicktools.co.uk/
I once got dragged in buying a (chinese made?) WW combination set on a jumble which seemed good quality.
When trying them out, there where only 2 that more or less fitted. All others where either to small or to large...   
Wasted €35 on them. *angry*
Title: Re: Tooling Up
Post by: trevinoz on 12.01. 2018 22:20
GB, that spanner size is 25/32 AF. Not common but can be found.
Title: Re: Tooling Up
Post by: Greybeard on 12.01. 2018 23:04
GB, that spanner size is 25/32 AF. Not common but can be found.
Thanks for that. I wonder why it's such an odd size.
Title: Re: Tooling Up
Post by: RoyC on 13.01. 2018 07:08
GB, that spanner size is 25/32 AF. Not common but can be found.
Thanks for that. I wonder why it's such an odd size.
Lots on ebay  https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2057872.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.H0.X25%2F32+AF+spanner.TRS0&_nkw=25%2F32+AF+spanner&_sacat=0 
Title: Re: Tooling Up
Post by: duTch on 13.01. 2018 10:58

...and when you are close to being on the road,  you may ponder a toolbox kit like reasonably covered here   *smile* ;
 https://www.a7a10.net/forum/index.php?topic=12076.msg93559#msg93559 (https://www.a7a10.net/forum/index.php?topic=12076.msg93559#msg93559)
Title: Re: Tooling Up
Post by: Rex on 13.01. 2018 23:58
GB, that spanner size is 25/32 AF. Not common but can be found.
Thanks for that. I wonder why it's such an odd size.

That's a spanner which may fit, but early post-War Britain didn't use spanners with A/F on them as that's Unified nomenclature, and other than Lend-lease stuff still here, Unified threads would have been unknown, especially for a huge business conglomeration like BSA.
Weren't Rubery Owen another part of the BSA empire?
Title: Re: Tooling Up
Post by: Greybeard on 14.01. 2018 09:20
So that begs the question; what size spanner should it be?
Title: Re: Tooling Up
Post by: JulianS on 14.01. 2018 10:08
I use the large end of an old BSA spanner marked 15 832. The tool list describes this as a mainshaft nut spanner. It measures about 0.8 inch across flats and given a bit of wear in it is about 25/32 inch.

Unified threads were not entirely unknown to BSA, the pressure relief valve thread being 7/8 inch x 16 tpi UNS (Unified Special)
Title: Re: Tooling Up
Post by: worntorn on 14.01. 2018 14:10
Kokens makes a very nice little set of 3/8" drive Imperial sockets.
Also available in 12 point , if needed. The six point has less tendency to round off the bolt head or nut .

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1Tp3zJVkUKNCoeCyCJ4NFpp2pAA7LVUj_/view?usp=drivesdk
Title: Re: Tooling Up
Post by: hdawson on 03.02. 2018 11:23
I have cut down many open ended spanners over the years for those specific (tight) jobs that seemed that the only other option was to remove the engine to get access!!
One particular job on the Matchless required grinding a spanner to suit as nothing would fit !!??
However , my whitworths are to expensive to cut in half  *eek*