The BSA A7-A10 Forum

Technical => A7 & A10 Engine => Topic started by: Stephen Foster on 27.09. 2012 08:50

Title: Grease in timing cover for dynamo chain ?
Post by: Stephen Foster on 27.09. 2012 08:50
Im just about to fit the timing cover & am a bit unsure about 3 things ?
 1/ How tight should the dynamo drive chain be ?

2/ Ought the section be packed with grease ?

3/ Which type or brand of grease ?

Thanks in advance ,

Steve ...
Title: Re: Grease in timing cover for dynamo chain ?
Post by: stu.andrews on 27.09. 2012 09:09
Allow about 1/4 inch play on the chain but be careful as, when you tighten the dynamo clamp, the chain will tighten. Also press the dynamo hard against the inner cover to allow the cork to seal. Yes, pack the volume with grease but not too much. A light grease that will become semi fluid when hot is ideal.
Title: Re: Grease in timing cover for dynamo chain ?
Post by: Billybream on 27.09. 2012 10:11
Hi Steve. Stu,s reply is spot on, not to much written on grease and quantity, the 1/4" play should be in the middle of the chain, and recheck after tightening, as a slack chain can easily damage the casing.
Title: Re: Grease in timing cover for dynamo chain ?
Post by: iansoady on 27.09. 2012 13:28
I must say I've always wondered why so much grease is specified as once the chain carves a path through it I can't see how the rest can lubricate anything?
Title: Re: Grease in timing cover for dynamo chain ?
Post by: a10gf on 27.09. 2012 13:46
Quote
much grease is specified as once the chain carves a path through it

Yes, I have seen this. I believe a good dose of drivechain lubricant (from spraycan) is better. Will penetrate and stick, and stay on\in the chain.
Title: Re: Grease in timing cover for dynamo chain ?
Post by: Toby on 27.09. 2012 15:43
I always apply a lot of grease together with some heavy Engine Oil, this is so the lower run of the chain dips into the mix also the grease being flung around creates an inner seal as well as dripping onto the chain. I do the same with gearboxes and it works quite well.
Title: Re: Grease in timing cover for dynamo chain ?
Post by: A10Boy on 27.09. 2012 16:20
The thing is most people use a high melting point grease, that is the one that carves a path and then doesn't lub the chain. As has been said, use a low melting point grease then it will soften and slide down to the drive wheel and chain.

Better still, clean it out and fit a belt kit. I have fitted the 15mm wide one from Dynamo regs and it works a treat.
Title: Re: Grease in timing cover for dynamo chain ?
Post by: Goldy on 27.09. 2012 17:56
As the chain is totally enclosed it is in the perfect situation, so as has been said, once lightly lubricated that's it.
Title: Re: Grease in timing cover for dynamo chain ?
Post by: KiwiGF on 28.09. 2012 07:10
Sorry probably  being dum here but I had a look in super crap and ripco and did not find a low melting point grease it seems a low melting point is not something that they advertise as a "good" feature?

As Im finally getting close to putting my engine back together this is something I also would like to get right eg what grease to use.

Title: Re: Grease in timing cover for dynamo chain ?
Post by: BSA_54A10 on 28.09. 2012 12:43
Google "liquid grease" .
most of them are fairly well the same.
Find your favourite brand then ask them where it is stocked.
Usually it will be a specialist bearing shop as it is usually used to lubricate bearings.
I am currently running Castrol in the M20 but prior to that it was Penrite.
In both cases it had to be ordered in.
Title: Re: Grease in timing cover for dynamo chain ?
Post by: iansoady on 28.09. 2012 13:36
It's used in some Land Rover front swivel joints so available from LR specialists.

I still can't see why you need so much for a tiny little chain in a perfect environment with hardly any load on it.
Title: Re: Grease in timing cover for dynamo chain ?
Post by: Goldy on 28.09. 2012 14:17
BSA service sheet number 208 says apply 1/4 lbs of light grease. BSA obviously were not particularly bothered about the type of grease used, so I don't think that you need to be.
Title: Re: Grease in timing cover for dynamo chain ?
Post by: Topdad on 28.09. 2012 21:22
Hi Stephen, i've used both chain and belt systems. like the belt but never had any problems with the chain only changed when dynamo uprated to 12v and wanted a higher ratio. Although I know realise from the sensible comments about HMP grease ,which i used , wasn't the best, regards BobH
Title: Re: Grease in timing cover for dynamo chain ?
Post by: KiwiGF on 28.09. 2012 22:48
Hi good point ref the land rover grease I actually have some as I have a 96 discovery in need of some tlc, it's sort of a mix of oil and grease said to be 1000 grade by some, it lubes the front cv joints and" king pins"

Called One shot swivel grease (cos it cannt be drained out of the swivel once you replace your sae90 with it) you can buy it expensively from land rover dealers or aftermarket equivalent is available I bought mine from the uk from "Paddock Spares" a uk based land rover parts specialist and it's cheaper to get it from them and freight it to nz than buy it locally- which is plain silly!

Title: Re: Grease in timing cover for dynamo chain ?
Post by: bsa-bill on 29.09. 2012 11:55
Lots of machinery these days use a liquid grease/lubricant, I'm not too sure how you would keep it in place until you got the outer case on, lay the bike on it's side I suppose but then I'd have to wait for a mate to come along to get it back up again *sad2* 
Title: Re: Grease in timing cover for dynamo chain ?
Post by: BSA_54A10 on 30.09. 2012 00:37
You chill it Bill.
Over night in the freezer will make it a bit stiffer than wheel bearing grease .
However the Castrol is thick enough to stay in place while you are putting the cover on.
If you use liquid grease you do nor need to fill the entire chamber as it will go soft as the engine heats up and end up i a pool at the bottom being thrown around by the chain then draining back into the pool.
Title: Re: Grease in timing cover for dynamo chain ?
Post by: bsa-bill on 30.09. 2012 10:45
Quote
You chill it Bill.

Good one BSA_54A10  I hadn't thought of that, comes from living in the past when fridges were not in every household, desirable but needed a lot of saving for
Title: Re: Grease in timing cover for dynamo chain ?
Post by: muskrat on 30.09. 2012 16:23
Every shed has a beer fridge, don't it? *beer*
Cheers
Title: Re: Grease in timing cover for dynamo chain ?
Post by: bsa-bill on 30.09. 2012 16:40
Quote
Every shed has a beer fridge, don't it?

Nope not up here in NE UK - no need - to cold as it is, OTOH you'd know where it is in a fridge,l I discovered two bottles of "Old Peculier" that I'd stashed out of site some decades ago (decided not to risk them as most Super Markets still sell it)

by the by were putting a little freezer in the shed, I recall my son having some Newcastle brown that you put in the freezer until the special label changed colour, it was then apparently  at the optimum temp for consumption*beer*
Title: Re: Grease in timing cover for dynamo chain ?
Post by: MG on 01.10. 2012 14:09
I thought you Brits were only drinking warm beer?
Mainly because Lucas made your fridges?
 *lol*

Sorry, I couldn't resist.  *whistle*  *beer*
Title: Re: Grease in timing cover for dynamo chain ?
Post by: A10Boy on 02.10. 2012 17:03
Markus,

I was going to say that we brits who like proper brewed "Real Ales" like them served lightly chilled never warm. On the other hand Lagers and other gnats pi$$ chemical concoctions are served ice cold coz thats the only way to get any flavour out of them.

But I won't

 *smile*
Title: Re: Grease in timing cover for dynamo chain ?
Post by: bsa-bill on 02.10. 2012 17:31
I wouldn't dream of saying that either Andy - even if it is true
Title: Re: Grease in timing cover for dynamo chain ?
Post by: Topdad on 03.10. 2012 12:12
We'll let you off Markus , personally could never understand having beer so cold that you can't taste it ,I'm sure some young drinkers would drink carbonated wood alcohol if it were marketed as "super cold " there loss give me a pint of "spitfire" any time,regards Bob 
Title: Re: Grease in timing cover for dynamo chain ?
Post by: duTch on 03.10. 2012 14:16


Not getting sidetracked with 'grogology', I've been wondering if that old school chain lube that's in a tin and you wash the chain and then put it on the lube and heat it on the stove (yep-STOVE, beside the toast), or other heaty thing so the lube soaks through, then let it cool...?and whatever goop comes out with it will be sufficient?
 I've not used it, but think it's maybe a graphite base? Maybe no longer available?? ,but would be a good dynamo-hum lube?
Title: Re: Grease in timing cover for dynamo chain ?
Post by: bsa-bill on 03.10. 2012 14:32
Putoline (German I think ) make a chain wax much the same as Link-Life, I have a tin that I bought many moons ago for £7.00 UK, can't say what it's like as I haven't replaced a chain yet, it's my intention to have new chains on and treat the old one with the wax ready to swap around.
Title: Re: Grease in timing cover for dynamo chain ?
Post by: MG on 04.10. 2012 07:28
Andy, Bill, Bob, you caught me  *smile*. I can't argue about the quality of good, well-temperated Ale, I might have enjoyed one or the other glass during visits to your country already...  *grins*
But I have yet too find something you can legitimately call "coffee" or something that comes close to our dark leaven bread. But that's another story, when in Rome...

Back on the topic: I'm not sure whether anything that will be good for a rear chain will suffice for the dynamo, at revs up to say 3000 or even 3500rpm on the intermediate gear, low melting point grease sounds like the best idea to me. It is also a matter of transporting heat away to the cases, just like on the primary chain, which the then liquified grease should be capable of.
Btw., even at good lubrication, I have noticed an alarming rate of wear on what used to be high-quality Renolds chains. Could it be that they aren't what they used to be?

Best, Markus
Title: Re: Grease in timing cover for dynamo chain ?
Post by: groily on 04.10. 2012 08:45
Interesting points Markus on Renolds chain and warm beer.
I persist in using Renolds for rears. But I do think you're right, they don't seem to last the way I remember.
It is not impossible that some of this might be to do with pattern sprockets not lasting well enough of course. And it's too tempting not to change that g'box sprocket too often!
Btw, what mileage do folk here (who use their bikes a lot in all weather) find they can get out of a (reasonably) well-maintained and aligned rear chain?
For primaries, I have several hundred links of Elite in a tin, which seems to do OK, and is easily available.
For dynamos (back on topic) I use a toothed belt so don't know .  . .
For warm (or even chilled) beer I substituted red grape juice for Greene King IPA a long time ago now - with only beneficial effects!
Cheers, Bill
Title: Re: Grease in timing cover for dynamo chain ?
Post by: Stephen Foster on 04.10. 2012 09:07
"Greene King" ...gets My vote !!
Title: Re: Grease in timing cover for dynamo chain ?
Post by: muskrat on 04.10. 2012 10:14
 I'm considering going back to chain after my 3rd belt went to the dentist. I remember getting about 5 years out of the chains and using low melt grease changed about once a year. Doing about 10K miles a year on the '51 back then, lucky to do 3K these days.
 You lot may have invented beer but a German immigrant perfected it down here. Reschs Pilsener served at 3 degrees C
 *beer*
Title: Re: Grease in timing cover for dynamo chain ?
Post by: duTch on 04.10. 2012 13:54

  Arrrgh, Dry Resches......I was working 'bout a hundred miles north of Blackwater in '78 when the Great Beer strike was on, nothin' but canned beer from all over the country for four months, went to town for some gear, and stopped for a coldie(as we DID), and there was Resches ON TAP- beautie, I'll have one of those...in a glass!! *eek*....choke -gag- spit.....a few months later was in Sydney town, 'Angle' pub at Manly had D.Resches was tolerable with a dash of lemmingaid.
 Sorry,but that's my resches story, glad you like it Muskie- you can have it *conf*
   
     Oh yeah, dynamo chain- my theory on the chain-lube was that you soak it in, and also slop a bit(just enough for the chain to run in) in bottom of the case to keep it happy, engine temp should keep it fluid?
Title: Re: Grease in timing cover for dynamo chain ?
Post by: Stephen Foster on 04.10. 2012 16:33
"Muskrat" ,
Going to try to source "Rechies" in the real ale pubs in Preston over weekend ..Ill let You know !
Sounds interesting ? Been sampling "Rouschbeer" ? lately ..has a smokey bacon taste .
Steve..
Title: Re: Grease in timing cover for dynamo chain ?
Post by: morris on 04.10. 2012 22:23
Anybody in for an "Old Speckled Hen"? wink2

I have a dab of Castrol LM grease in the timing cover, but find it to heavy, as it is actually a bearing grease. It has a tendency to stick where it's been thrown.
I am thinking of using an EP 0 grease, which is a semi liquid grease, and can be found at any supplier of oils and greases. It's thick enough to hold up for the time you need to close the cover.
It penetrates well, and if left standing, will sink nicely to the bottom again. This type of grease is mainly used in machines, but I reckon it should work well in a BSA timing case.

Regarding the Renolds chain, I was wondering if they really are of lesser quality, or are we all getting older and start to suffer the "it used to be better in the old days" syndrome........?*dunno*
Title: Re: Grease in timing cover for dynamo chain ?
Post by: iansoady on 05.10. 2012 10:46
Sadly I think Renolds is no longer made in the UK. DID and IWIS are good makes but I don't know if they do a size for the dynamo chain.
Title: Re: Grease in timing cover for dynamo chain ?
Post by: Topdad on 05.10. 2012 14:03
yes , that could be the reason but also I'm sure that there are different variants of there chain, I know in the 70's that a guy I worked for used to get reynolds chain which was intended for machines same size ,5/8 x 3/8, but was considerably cheaper and boy it wore out in weeks ,trouble we had and never sold it again.BobH
Title: Re: Grease in timing cover for dynamo chain ?
Post by: BSA_54A10 on 05.10. 2012 19:28
Quote
Putoline (German I think ) make a chain wax much the same as Link-Life, I have a tin that I bought many moons ago for £7.00 UK, can't say what it's like as I haven't replaced a chain yet, it's my intention to have new chains on and treat the old one with the wax ready to swap around.

Bill,

Do not wait for the old chain to wear out, replace it with the new one NOW.
Clean up the old chain properly then grease it and swap them over again when you do the next tune up.
better still is to get a third chain and do a 3 chain swap.
Chains are a lot cheaper than sprockets and a whole lot easier to replace
Title: Re: Grease in timing cover for dynamo chain ?
Post by: Greybeard on 10.10. 2012 23:31
I've greased my dynamo chain today. I used Castrol Spheerol EPL2. See link below. 400gm for £2.52; it was on special offer as well!

http://www.cromwell.co.uk/CST7407900CEq

Neil Ives UK