The BSA A7-A10 Forum

Technical => Clutch, Primary, Gearbox => Topic started by: The_Beast on 11.03. 2009 17:00

Title: Slipping Kickstart.
Post by: The_Beast on 11.03. 2009 17:00
Hi Everyone. My 58 Goldflash has started to "slip" when trying to kick start and won?t turn engine over. there is resistance there and does try to turn. i have had my clutch to pieces everything looks fine. The clutch its self is not slipping. Now. If i put in gear and apply the rear brake it does not slip, its solid, so in my mind this rules out kick start issues. Don?t want to strip gearbox if there is nothing wrong with it.  However I am often wrong and reside on a different planet to most. any help in diagnosing fault would be appreciated or if you have suffered same fault. Thanks
Title: Re: Slipping Kickstart.
Post by: Lannis on 11.03. 2009 17:30
I'm betting that it's the clutch, even though it doesn't appear to be slipping on the road.

It's amazing how a clutch will pull 600 pounds of motorcycle and rider down the road, but will slip when the engine is kicked over to start it, but it happens.

Usually, by the time a clutch is slipping on the kickstart, it's slipping on the road a bit too.  The best test is getting ready to head up a hill in third or fourth gear at 3000 RPM or so, and open the throttle right up.

There's nothing else between the kickstart lever and the crankshaft that can "slip".  Break, maybe, or jump several teeth, but not slip.

Lannis
Title: Re: Slipping Kickstart.
Post by: bsa-bill on 11.03. 2009 18:37
Well there is also the cushdrive (nut turned off) I would think you might have noticed that.

All the best - Bill
Title: Re: Slipping Kickstart.
Post by: LJ. on 11.03. 2009 19:10
Lannis makes a good point... although my Blue A10 has been behaving in a similar fashion, slipping when kick starting, it has not been slipping out on the road. I guess the compression is very good and is acting as a resister to that first initial kick to zap it into life.
Title: Re: Slipping Kickstart.
Post by: a10sausage on 11.03. 2009 20:04
hi beast...i wonder if it is the woodruff key on the end of the gearbox mainshaft that has sheared....the clutch centre locates on to this...if this has sheared it might be the cause....does anybody else suport this theory...it would be nice to know ...or am i barking up the wrong tree...ruff...ruff.
Title: Re: Slipping Kickstart.
Post by: The_Beast on 12.03. 2009 10:57
Hi all. Thanks for your input but clutch is definitely not slipping, primary casing is off and i marked the clutch pressure plate against the drive side and no slippage at all. i am going to investigate the woodruff key on the end of the gearbox mainshaft. this theory fits all symptoms. will report on my findings.  thanks everyone.
Title: Re: Slipping Kickstart.
Post by: The_Beast on 12.03. 2009 13:23
Hi everyone. Found the problem. the inner clutch drum has for reasons unknown has de-castellated and is now just round. please see photos. i suppose in a good bad way this is good as i am now going to modify to the later 4 spring clutch system. does any one know of a reputable seller of a complete 4 spring clutch kit. thanks for your help.
Title: Re: Slipping Kickstart.
Post by: groily on 12.03. 2009 17:44
Blimey . . . now that does count as wear . . . what's the shaft like!? Don't know where 4-spring clutches come from, but bet Draganfly can help . . .
Title: Re: Slipping Kickstart.
Post by: dpaddock on 12.03. 2009 19:36
Try C and D Autos: canddautos@eidosnet.co.uk
Title: Re: Slipping Kickstart.
Post by: RichardL on 12.03. 2009 19:41
Maybe, ask the very experienced here about their proper-running 6-spring clutches. I am not among the "very experienced," but my 6-spring seems to work fine. The idea of a $50 (36 GBP) clutch basket seems inviting versus maybe more than $200 for a 4-spring. OK, I'm bracing myself against a flurry of attacks for being thrifty, and hope that it is not seen as thrifty agaisnt reason.

Richard L.
Title: Re: Slipping Kickstart.
Post by: olev on 12.03. 2009 20:17
gday beastie,
if Orabanda has fitted all his A10's with Suzuki clutches in darkest Kalgoolie, they can't be that hard to fit.
and Phil Pearson in England likes screwing them onto gold stars.
just a thought?  cheers


http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn82/orabanda/Marioclutch2.jpg
Title: Re: Slipping Kickstart.
Post by: BSA_54A10 on 13.03. 2009 00:33
And if we are talking sacralage here a Yamaha SR , RD , XT or 400-600cc twins (cant remember their code) can all be made to fit as the entire clutch is rivited onto the drive gear which can be replaced with a sproket or just rivited inside your old drum.

As for 6 spring clutches, it will all depend on the orientation of the pressure plate to the rolling direction of the steel that it was pressed out of as to how much flex ( or variations of flex) there is and that is the difference between a beautiful clutch & an impossible to adjust bugger of a clutch.
Bike beesa
Trevor
Title: Re: Slipping Kickstart.
Post by: zitman on 13.03. 2009 12:23
The Beast:

I had all sorts of problems with the 6 spring clutch on my A7.  I have "upgraded" to a four spring conversion, It is excellent, after a little tweaking as the centre nut kept coming loose.

i tried for a few weeks to source a clutch centre for the 6 spring and was told everywhere to avoid the ones you can buy now as they are rubbish (C & D told me they refused to stock them as did Burton Bike Bits.  DragAnFly said they would sell me one but would rather not as I would probably return it).

I got the 4 spring conversion from George Prew but it was missing the spring cups, which I still haven't got 3 weeks later!

I have ridden bikes with a 6 spring clutch and they were fine.

Basically my view is if you can get a NOS 6 spring clutch centre and set the clutch up properly (I am told this is a bit of a black art) then great.  If not go the 4 spring route.

Z
Title: Re: Slipping Kickstart.
Post by: a10sausage on 13.03. 2009 17:20
the beast...throw that 6 spring clutch in a swamp and buy a 4 spring...or you will be banned from sausage and egg barmcakes for the rest of your life....aj *conf* *smiley4*
Title: Re: Slipping Kickstart.
Post by: The_Beast on 13.03. 2009 19:01
A.J. You CANT ban me fom Sausage n Egg Barms

Hi Eveyone, After much sole searching and wallet searching i have decided to buy another six spring cente basket, to put me on for six months or so untill i can get the SRM 4 spring conversion kit. The idea of a Japanese Clutch is tempting but i would like to keep it Brittish, a  last resort maybe
 
  Thanks to eveyone for your help
Title: Re: Slipping Kickstart.
Post by: RichardL on 13.03. 2009 19:14
i tried for a few weeks to source a clutch centre for the 6 spring and was told everywhere to avoid the ones you can buy now as they are rubbish

The probelm with my 6-spring basket when I got it was that the studs were not well swaged and, therefore, would turn when trying to thread on a Nylok nut. I brazed them all at the backside of the bsket and everything has worked fine. This, in no way, meant to detract from 4-spring versions. I just have no experience with them.

Richard L.
Title: Re: Slipping Kickstart.
Post by: flashblack on 15.03. 2009 07:58
Hey beast,
             There`s one one e-bay at the moment (NOS)
                       
                                          http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/BSA-GOLDSTAR-A10-NOS-SIX-SPRING-CLUTCH-CENTRE_W0QQitemZ170311360533QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_Motorcycle_Parts?hash=item170311360533&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66%3A2%7C65%3A10%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318 (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/BSA-GOLDSTAR-A10-NOS-SIX-SPRING-CLUTCH-CENTRE_W0QQitemZ170311360533QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_Motorcycle_Parts?hash=item170311360533&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66%3A2%7C65%3A10%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318)

                          hope that`s some help
                                            Richie