Author Topic: oil feed on/off tap v anti-sump valve  (Read 2986 times)

Offline BSA_54A10

  • Wise & Enlightened
  • *
  • Join Date: May 2008
  • Posts: 2018
  • Karma: 32
    • BSA National
Re: oil feed on/off tap v anti-sump valve
« Reply #15 on: 16.12. 2015 22:10 »
First thing to do is replace the spring.
Oddly enough people strip down their engines replace every thing except the spring that spends every second of running time compressed a tiny bit surrounded by hot oil.

Next, fit an extended sump that has the drain bolt in the side using longer studs not supplied bolts.
Fit it with the drain bolt pointing to the left, thus it is easier to remove while on the side stand and if inadvertently left out will blow oil onto hot left pipe and become most obvious before covering the rear tyre with oil
Bike Beesa
Trevor

Online worntorn

  • Valued Contributor
  • ****
  • Join Date: Jun 2015
  • Posts: 377
  • Karma: 3
Re: oil feed on/off tap v anti-sump valve
« Reply #16 on: 29.12. 2015 03:23 »
Here's my shut off. The bike won't start without turning on the ignition and the only ignition key is also the handle for the oil shut off ball valve. If you want to start the bike, you must first turn on the valve so that it will release the key.
Glen


Offline Peter in Aus

  • Valued Contributor
  • ****
  • Join Date: Feb 2014
  • Posts: 341
  • Karma: 1
  • South West, West Australia
Re: oil feed on/off tap v anti-sump valve
« Reply #17 on: 29.12. 2015 13:27 »
I think Viking has hit the nail on the head the oil pump is a lot of the problem with wet sumping they leak like a sieve.
Peter

Busselton West Australia
49 A7 longstroke
58 A10  SA

Offline kommando

  • A's Best Friend
  • ***
  • Join Date: Oct 2011
  • Posts: 38
  • Karma: 1
Re: oil feed on/off tap v anti-sump valve
« Reply #18 on: 21.01. 2016 10:12 »
I use a non return valve but I modified it before fitting, the spring is set to only just hold back 18" of oil in a tube so really light, the seat is rubber for a better seal and less chance of sticking. Before I start off I run the engine long enough for the return to be fresh oil in case it is sticking. Must be 20 odd years now with no problems, there is a risk but I have tried to make sure they are minimised.
No BSA twins just unit singles
Scotland

Offline hdawson

  • A's Best Friend
  • ***
  • Join Date: Feb 2016
  • Posts: 104
  • Karma: 0
Re: oil feed on/off tap v anti-sump valve
« Reply #19 on: 10.02. 2016 11:33 »
After  much agonizing over what to do with the weeping Super Rocket, I bit the bullet and simply fitted a ball valve to the oil inlet line.

I simply can't run the BSA frequently enough to keep the sump from filling and am reluctant to replace the original oil pump with a modern item.

I'm not sure about the issue of an air block (spurious?) or the argument that an engine requires maximum lube at startup - surely the sump is never dry.

Understanding the obvious risk involved, I have always checked my oil return to the tank on my start up routine anyway, and will always  do so.

Keen to hear your opinions.



61 BSA Super Rocket (cafe).
51 Matchless G9 Clubman.
81 Suzuki GSX 750 ES.
02 Triumph Sprint.

Offline Topdad

  • bob hebdon
  • Wise & Enlightened
  • *
  • Join Date: May 2011
  • Posts: 2242
  • Karma: 32
  • l
Re: oil feed on/off tap v anti-sump valve
« Reply #20 on: 10.02. 2016 12:36 »
fingers crossed it keeps working *eek*
" rules are made for the guidance of wise men and the blind obediance of fools"
United Kingdom

Online cyclobutch

  • Wise & Enlightened
  • *
  • Join Date: Aug 2010
  • Posts: 1510
  • Karma: 14
Re: oil feed on/off tap v anti-sump valve
« Reply #21 on: 10.02. 2016 12:59 »
I believe that the ball valve that I fitted on mine was the cause of sudden catastrophic failure. I had not checked oil return before heading off and the engine seized solid within the first half mile of that journey. Good luck, and do always check that return.
Various, including ...
'58 Iron Head Flash Bitza


Online muskrat

  • Global Moderator
  • Wise & Enlightened
  • **
  • Join Date: Jul 2009
  • Posts: 8265
  • Karma: 106
  • Lake Conjola NSW Oz
    • Shoalhaven Classic Motorcycle Club Inc
Re: oil feed on/off tap v anti-sump valve
« Reply #22 on: 10.02. 2016 13:19 »
Sounds of a broken record *ex*
The ball valve probably cost more and took longer to fit than a sump plate with a plug. The sump plate with plug won't destroy your motor. Takes just a few minutes to drain the sump but a long time and $$$ to rebuild a motor.
Cheers
'51 A7 plunger, '57 A7SS now A10CR,  '83 CB1100F, 88 FXST .
Australia
Muskys Plunger A7

Online orabanda

  • Wise & Enlightened
  • *
  • Join Date: Nov 2008
  • Posts: 1010
  • Karma: 21
Re: oil feed on/off tap v anti-sump valve
« Reply #23 on: 10.02. 2016 13:41 »
I'm with Musky.
Fit the sump plate, get down on your knees and bow in homage to your steed every time you take the plug out to drain it. The bikes appreciate the worship.

Offline hdawson

  • A's Best Friend
  • ***
  • Join Date: Feb 2016
  • Posts: 104
  • Karma: 0
Re: oil feed on/off tap v anti-sump valve
« Reply #24 on: 11.02. 2016 06:36 »
Thanks for your feedback guys.
I have always had a sump plug.
I don't know why they were not fitted from new.
Oil changing must be a pretty  messy affair without one.
I don't have a centre stand and when parked on the sidestand so much oil weeps onto the shed floor it's absurd.
I was at my wits end so fitted the $5 ball valve in half an hour.
Hardly a drip now.
By the way,the foot has a stress fracture from repeated kicks when hot.( second kick starter when cold)
Can't wait to solve that little problem.
Has anyone tried aerostart?

61 BSA Super Rocket (cafe).
51 Matchless G9 Clubman.
81 Suzuki GSX 750 ES.
02 Triumph Sprint.

Online cyclobutch

  • Wise & Enlightened
  • *
  • Join Date: Aug 2010
  • Posts: 1510
  • Karma: 14
Re: oil feed on/off tap v anti-sump valve
« Reply #25 on: 11.02. 2016 08:54 »
Sounds of a broken record *ex*

Yeah sorry. It still hurts is all.
Various, including ...
'58 Iron Head Flash Bitza


Offline duTch

  • Ricketty Rocketty Golden Flashback
  • Wise & Enlightened
  • *
  • Join Date: Oct 2011
  • Posts: 4540
  • Karma: 41
Re: oil feed on/off tap v anti-sump valve
« Reply #26 on: 11.02. 2016 09:35 »

 Am not a fan of this idea, I think I've said it before, and will likely suggest it again; if you don't get to ride  it much, why not drain the oil tank into a container if you think you're not going out again soon, and re-add it when you go out next. I can't see it matters if it's in a container different to the oil tank... *????*    You could even drain the oil through some kind of filter each time.
   

 If doing this, there's no need to even have to drain the sump if done early enough.
Started building in about 1977/8 a on average '52 A10 -built from bits 'n pieces never resto intended -maybe 'personalised'
Have a '74 850T Moto Guzzi since '92-best thing I ever bought doesn't need a kickstart 'cos it bump starts sooooooooo(mostly) easy
Australia

Online bsa-bill

  • Wise & Enlightened
  • *
  • Join Date: Mar 2006
  • Posts: 5456
  • Karma: 62
Re: oil feed on/off tap v anti-sump valve
« Reply #27 on: 11.02. 2016 09:36 »
Quote
Has anyone tried aerostart?

oh yes many times on diesels and occasionally on petrol engines but never on a bike.
now the thing is it has a reputation of once used the engines get hooked on it, never subscribed to that myself, I reckon if you need it then the engine needs looked and if it isn't looked at then the starting problem is going to remain the same and your going to need aerostart - simples.

All the best - Bill
1961 Flash - stock, reliable, steady, fantastic for shopping
1959 Rocket Gold Flash - blinged and tarted up  would have seizure if taken to  Tesco

Offline duTch

  • Ricketty Rocketty Golden Flashback
  • Wise & Enlightened
  • *
  • Join Date: Oct 2011
  • Posts: 4540
  • Karma: 41
Re: oil feed on/off tap v anti-sump valve
« Reply #28 on: 11.02. 2016 10:17 »

 
Quote
now the thing is it has a reputation of once used the engines get hooked on it, never subscribed to that myself, I reckon if you need it then the engine needs looked and if it isn't looked at then the starting problem is going to remain the same and your going to need aerostart - simples.

 I overlooked this issue- occasionally I get lazy/complacent, and I get a kick-back *bash*(need a kick-back unsmiley *????*).

      Then I revert to the "roll over to TDC ker-chunk" and give a solid shove- no probs (generally)
Started building in about 1977/8 a on average '52 A10 -built from bits 'n pieces never resto intended -maybe 'personalised'
Have a '74 850T Moto Guzzi since '92-best thing I ever bought doesn't need a kickstart 'cos it bump starts sooooooooo(mostly) easy
Australia

Offline magicflem

  • A's Best Friend
  • ***
  • Join Date: Jun 2010
  • Posts: 63
  • Karma: 0
  • Sydney NSW Australia
Re: oil feed on/off tap v anti-sump valve
« Reply #29 on: 16.02. 2016 00:32 »
NO, NO, NO, NEVER, NEVER EVER fit any sort of tap, valve or other device in the oil feed line.
Don't listen to anyone telling you different - Better to wet sump than to blow an engine.
1930 BSA B30-3 Side Valve Girder (being restored)
1955 BSA A10 Road Rocket
1955 BSA A10 Golden Flash
1956 BSA A10 Road Rocket
1951 BSA A10 Golden Flash
1956 BSA DB32 Gold Star Clubman
1958 BSA A10 Super Rocket
1961 BSA C15 (being restored)
1961 BSA C15 Star "America" (being restored)
1961 BSA A10 "Big Valve" Super Rocket (being restored)
1963 BSA A10 Rocket Gold Star