Author Topic: Sludge Trap?  (Read 1694 times)

Online TimK

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Sludge Trap?
« on: 13.06. 2016 07:02 »
I finally got around to splitting the cases on my Gold Flash, and rather than the slotted plugs I was expecting to find sealing the sludge traps they're sealed by blank plugs. I've attached a picture of one of them below, but they're both similar. I'm thinking that a PO may have given up after failing to drill them out and has welded up *conf* the drill holes to re-seal them. Has anyone seen anything similar and are there any ideas to remove them bearing in mind that my shed isn't very well equipped.
Tim Kerridge
Australia

beezermacc

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Re: Sludge Trap?
« Reply #1 on: 13.06. 2016 07:41 »
I don't think the plugs have been welded in. Even with the slots they can often be difficult to remove. The plugs are only about 8 mm deep and are usually made of soft iron so they shouldn't be too difficult to drill out. I would recommend starting with a smallish drill, maybe 3 mm, in the centre, and gradually increasing drill size until you are almost touching the threads, then break the remaining ring of sludge trap with a sharp pointed punch. Obviously you don't want to damage the threads but, even if you do, you can use some threadlok on the new plugs when they are fitted. I've seen some really horrible sludge trap damage in my time and it can always be repaired with the correct tap and some threadlok. Have fun!

Online muskrat

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Re: Sludge Trap?
« Reply #2 on: 13.06. 2016 09:22 »
 *work* *pull hair out* *bash* The things we find *ex*
I'd drill and try a large 3/8" easyout first. As beezermacc said the plugs are soft so if the easyout won't work proceed as he suggests. Just try to get your first hole as close to center as you can.
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Offline a10gf

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Re: Sludge Trap?
« Reply #3 on: 13.06. 2016 10:01 »
Quote
The things we find
Curses from previous owners :O)

If drilling out until threads is needed, I'd say get access to a bench drill, with the crank tightly secured (somehow) and everything finely adjusted before drilling.

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Online Greybeard

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Re: Sludge Trap?
« Reply #4 on: 13.06. 2016 10:03 »
I'd drill and try a large 3/8" easyout first.
If you do use an Easyout please use a good quality one. I've had cheapo's break in the hole and you don't want that!

Online TimK

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Re: Sludge Trap?
« Reply #5 on: 13.06. 2016 10:49 »
Thanks for the collected wisdom gents, I do have a drill press, so I'll have a go at drilling it out. I'm thinking I should lightly drill the punch marks first - what do you think?
Tim Kerridge
Australia

Offline a10gf

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Re: Sludge Trap?
« Reply #6 on: 13.06. 2016 12:22 »
Quote
the punch marks
If it looks like it may help, maybe a touch of cleaning up with a dremel for the inwards indentations ?

Doing this may allow for a better result if trying Easyout instead of drilling. Heat the crank and then cool down the plug with electronics freeze spray, then spray with lube, may help in breaking the old thread bond before applying force to the Easyout.

And patience is the best tool :O)

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Online groily

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Re: Sludge Trap?
« Reply #7 on: 13.06. 2016 13:22 »
I'd also invest a couple of beer vouchers in a suitable-size and easily available 'centre drill' to give you a better chance of a central hole. Being short fat and rigid in the shank department, they are much better at this sort of thing as they don't wander. They also have a tapered cutting edge beyond the short pointy bit that really helps with countersunk screws (if they are countersunk, can't remember but think they all are). I use them all the time to get messed-up dynamo pole shoe screws out without harming the female threads, which is a similar problem.
Bill

Offline a10gf

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Re: Sludge Trap?
« Reply #8 on: 13.06. 2016 13:49 »
^^^
Quote
easily available 'centre drill' to give you a better chance of a central hole. Being short fat and rigid in the shank department, they are much better at this sort of thing as they don't wander.
Good point. Regarding no-wander, take a look at this 'twin-tip' kind of drillbits > https://www.machinemart.co.uk/p/dt7926qz-29pce-extreme-2-drill-bit-set/

Have used those extensively at work here, excellent stuff for controlled & clean drilling.

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Online Billybream

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Re: Sludge Trap?
« Reply #9 on: 13.06. 2016 14:00 »
Yes most are battle to get out, but has to be done to reveal the cranks inner secret. On mine I ground a suitable Allen key, leaving the straight peice to drive into a appropriate sized drilled hole in the sludge trap plug, then with a wrench they unscrewed quite easily. When you order you replacements I would try and get the Allen Socket version.
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Online RichardL

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Re: Sludge Trap?
« Reply #10 on: 13.06. 2016 14:13 »
Following-up what Billybream has mentioned, here is a link to a more detailed description for using an allen key. Specifics are about 1/2-way down the page.

http://bsa.hailwood.com/endplug.html

Richard L.
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Online mugwump

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Re: Sludge Trap?
« Reply #11 on: 13.06. 2016 17:22 »
I always try the simplest of methods first, before you start drilling holes. Try and remove any punch marks and then heat up with a blow-lamp and try punching it round with a relatively broad punch, say approx 3/16" tip. If a thread lock/lock-tight goo has been used the heat can loosen some makes.
I have removed some in the past like this. Being a relatively wide dia bung you can exert fairly good torque on it this way.

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Online RichardL

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Re: Sludge Trap?
« Reply #12 on: 13.06. 2016 17:37 »
Maybe, but considering the recess of the plug, there is good chance of slipping off and putting a really good gouge in the threads. It's not like the plug is going to be preserved, so drilling won't be spoiling anything. So, just for fun, I have US$5.00 to wager with any one (and only one) taker that the punch-for-torque method doesn't work in this case. Anyone interested? Winner (I mean "I", that is) would be paid by PayPal. Of course, TimK would have to try it and report the results.

Richard L.
Plan on signing up for the world-wide 2020 DISTINGUISHED GENTLEMAN'S RIDEon September 27, 2020. This year it's a solo or pillion ride in dapper attire. Watch website at https://www.gentlemansride.com for details.


Online groily

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Re: Sludge Trap?
« Reply #13 on: 13.06. 2016 21:20 »
Hadn't seen those 'extreme 2' bits before - look like a very handy addition to the weaponry. Best get some I think. Thanks to you A10GF.
Bill

Offline coater87

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Re: Sludge Trap?
« Reply #14 on: 13.06. 2016 22:54 »
 I have given up completely on any easy outs. The only easy part is the "easy to break off in your hole" part.

 A buddy of mine put me onto left hand taps and bolts for larger stuff like this. Drill it, tap it, then you could even use an impact if you wanted. Worse that could happen is you strip the threads.

 Much better than trying to drill, punch, twist a broken easy out while you sweat, cuss, and bleed...
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