Author Topic: Anyone ever had this much trouble starting a bike?  (Read 1720 times)

Online Greybeard

  • Jack of all trades; master of none.
  • Wise & Enlightened
  • *
  • Join Date: Feb 2011
  • Posts: 5849
  • Karma: 32
Re: Anyone ever had this much trouble starting a bike?
« Reply #15 on: 20.05. 2017 18:28 »
By the way Greybeard, with modern petrol 3/8 B.T.D.C. might provoke pinking.
11/32" here with an auto AR unit

Offline duTch

  • Ricketty Rocketty Golden Flashback
  • Wise & Enlightened
  • *
  • Join Date: Oct 2011
  • Posts: 4540
  • Karma: 41
Re: Anyone ever had this much trouble starting a bike?
« Reply #16 on: 29.05. 2017 09:05 »

 
Quote
Thank the lord for that, I was getting worried!

 No mate- thank Billy Bream...   *beer* *respect*

 
Quote
Try swooping the HT leads over, always happens to me after any timing changes.
If that fails, ensure you give the carb plenty of tickle until the fuel runneth over.
Started building in about 1977/8 a on average '52 A10 -built from bits 'n pieces never resto intended -maybe 'personalised'
Have a '74 850T Moto Guzzi since '92-best thing I ever bought doesn't need a kickstart 'cos it bump starts sooooooooo(mostly) easy
Australia

Offline bikerboy

  • Valued Contributor
  • ****
  • Join Date: Dec 2011
  • Posts: 336
  • Karma: 4
Re: Anyone ever had this much trouble starting a bike?
« Reply #17 on: 16.07. 2017 23:32 »
Years ago the setting was 3/8 or 11/32, depending on model, but with modern day fuel it normally pinks like crazy thats why people are setting it to 5/16 btdc

Offline Tumbleweed

  • A's Best Friend
  • ***
  • Join Date: Feb 2012
  • Posts: 205
  • Karma: 0
Re: Anyone ever had this much trouble starting a bike?
« Reply #18 on: 24.07. 2017 15:56 »
hi everyone  , glad to here you got the bike going after swapping the plug leads , I wish mine was as simple,  ive done everything as you did , ive been kicking and kicking for hours , its fired twice ,  ive tried other carbs , keep checking the timing using a disc and dipstick ,  what I have now is after priming the carb I try to kick it over and the compression is very hard indeed  almost impossible to turnover,  but if I remove the plug leads it will kick over  normally .    any ideas welcome  , tw
Semper in excretia sumus solum profundum veriat.

Online Greybeard

  • Jack of all trades; master of none.
  • Wise & Enlightened
  • *
  • Join Date: Feb 2011
  • Posts: 5849
  • Karma: 32
Re: Anyone ever had this much trouble starting a bike?
« Reply #19 on: 24.07. 2017 16:04 »
...I try to kick it over and the compression is very hard indeed  almost impossible to turnover,  but if I remove the plug leads it will kick over  normally...

This makes me think that the timing is very advanced.

Offline Tumbleweed

  • A's Best Friend
  • ***
  • Join Date: Feb 2012
  • Posts: 205
  • Karma: 0
Re: Anyone ever had this much trouble starting a bike?
« Reply #20 on: 24.07. 2017 16:15 »
thanks greybeard ,  I will look at it again tomorrow ,   tw
Semper in excretia sumus solum profundum veriat.

Offline coater87

  • Wise & Enlightened
  • *
  • Join Date: Jul 2008
  • Posts: 1181
  • Karma: 6
Re: Anyone ever had this much trouble starting a bike?
« Reply #21 on: 25.07. 2017 10:15 »
 I have actually had this problem years and years ago.

 I had assembled my bike with the parts I had, all in rough shape.

 I could kick the bike over fine with the plugs out, put the plugs in and I could barely punch it over. Matter of fact I actually managed to break the outer gearbox cover trying. I put it all back in boxes and put it in the garage rafters.

 Turned out the bushings on the inner and outer gearbox covers for the kicker arm were shot, and the ratchet mechanism was junk. The added compression of the plugs must have been just enough to completely cock the whole mechanism and jam it near solid.

 Plugs out, kicked over smooth. Plugs in, it got harder and harder to kick over until I cracked the bushing out of the cover.

 Simple fix, but for the 20 odd years it sat in the rafters I imagined all types of horrors....

 Lee
Central Wisconsin in the U.S.

Offline Tumbleweed

  • A's Best Friend
  • ***
  • Join Date: Feb 2012
  • Posts: 205
  • Karma: 0
Re: Anyone ever had this much trouble starting a bike?
« Reply #22 on: 25.07. 2017 10:48 »
 hi lee,  mine kicks over ok with the plugs in but leads off    , with the leads on its almost impossible to turn it over , I have had a look at the timing again and it was advanced ,   to about 10 deg btdc  ive been trying the fag paper method but its on a hump or magnet in the magneto , I am thinking is it before this hump or after or dead in the middle  ( can anyone tell me)   there has even been a tiny spark while ive been trying . I am hoping its not the same prob as lee but the simptems are  different       thanks   tw  any info is value to me
Semper in excretia sumus solum profundum veriat.

Offline Topdad

  • bob hebdon
  • Wise & Enlightened
  • *
  • Join Date: May 2011
  • Posts: 2220
  • Karma: 32
  • l
Re: Anyone ever had this much trouble starting a bike?
« Reply #23 on: 25.07. 2017 16:39 »
Tumbleweed, first rotate the points and make sure you get a gap of approx 12 thou ,that they are clean and flat  then with BTDC set  and auto advance off it's taper ,turn the points with fag paper between them until it just begins to allow the paper to slid ,fix the auto advance with the weights jammed fully advanced back on the the magneto ,check points haven't moved ,bob s your uncle ,done . *smile*
" rules are made for the guidance of wise men and the blind obediance of fools"
United Kingdom

Offline Tumbleweed

  • A's Best Friend
  • ***
  • Join Date: Feb 2012
  • Posts: 205
  • Karma: 0
Re: Anyone ever had this much trouble starting a bike?
« Reply #24 on: 25.07. 2017 17:43 »
thanks topdad,   it takes some doing with the magnet it tends to flop one side or the other     patience is needed  I suppose . tw
Semper in excretia sumus solum profundum veriat.

Offline coater87

  • Wise & Enlightened
  • *
  • Join Date: Jul 2008
  • Posts: 1181
  • Karma: 6
Re: Anyone ever had this much trouble starting a bike?
« Reply #25 on: 25.07. 2017 18:26 »
Patients,

 Or to needle nose vise grips.

 Someone might have the idea of taping the jaws of these two vice grips with a lot of electrical tape to make them "soft jaws".

 Then set the points gap.

 Rotate the points where you want and clamp jaws on the cam ring in front and in back so the points can't easily move. Gently tighten the AA unit and check timing.

 I ***** around trying to set them but they always moved. After about 20 failures I used the needle nose vice grips and hit it the second time.

 Just be gentle, the grips just help enough to get the job done.

Lee
Central Wisconsin in the U.S.

Offline Tumbleweed

  • A's Best Friend
  • ***
  • Join Date: Feb 2012
  • Posts: 205
  • Karma: 0
Re: Anyone ever had this much trouble starting a bike?
« Reply #26 on: 25.07. 2017 20:16 »
good info thanks very much , I can stop them riding either side of the hump   ,     tw
Semper in excretia sumus solum profundum veriat.

Offline muskrat

  • Global Moderator
  • Wise & Enlightened
  • **
  • Join Date: Jul 2009
  • Posts: 8098
  • Karma: 106
  • Lake Conjola NSW Oz
    • Shoalhaven Classic Motorcycle Club Inc
Re: Anyone ever had this much trouble starting a bike?
« Reply #27 on: 25.07. 2017 20:38 »
I use a timber wedge (1/2 a timber cloths peg) between the post & camring. Same for the AA unit.
Cheers
'51 A7 plunger, '57 A7SS now A10CR,  '83 CB1100F, .
Australia
Muskys Plunger A7

Offline duTch

  • Ricketty Rocketty Golden Flashback
  • Wise & Enlightened
  • *
  • Join Date: Oct 2011
  • Posts: 4540
  • Karma: 41
Re: Anyone ever had this much trouble starting a bike?
« Reply #28 on: 25.07. 2017 20:52 »

  I may have missed something *conf2*, but when setting the points gap I just let the lobe sit anywhere in the minor diameter of the cam-ring and check in a couple of spots (@ just after fully open and just before closing) for each side ......when happy rotate the breaker plate to the 'just opening' position and with a wedge in the ATD to hold it, tighten the nut remove wedge; Happy days *smile*.... seems to work ok
Started building in about 1977/8 a on average '52 A10 -built from bits 'n pieces never resto intended -maybe 'personalised'
Have a '74 850T Moto Guzzi since '92-best thing I ever bought doesn't need a kickstart 'cos it bump starts sooooooooo(mostly) easy
Australia

Offline Topdad

  • bob hebdon
  • Wise & Enlightened
  • *
  • Join Date: May 2011
  • Posts: 2220
  • Karma: 32
  • l
Re: Anyone ever had this much trouble starting a bike?
« Reply #29 on: 26.07. 2017 11:20 »
I'm with Dutch , fingers crossed I've never had aproblem with the mag moving .
" rules are made for the guidance of wise men and the blind obediance of fools"
United Kingdom