Author Topic: Magneto types  (Read 564 times)

Offline wortluck

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Magneto types
« on: 01.05. 2018 17:14 »
Will a KVF 50 mag fit my A10.  It looks very similar, including the ATD.  What about a K2FC?  Existing ATD is currently being repaired - hopefully in time for the Bank Holiday sunny weather!

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Re: Magneto types
« Reply #1 on: 01.05. 2018 17:26 »

 I *think* the 'V' indicates KVF is for V-Twin, K2FC I also *think* is a competition mag which may work better but not necessarily- the Maggie-Gurus will have a better idea
Started building in about 1977/8 a on average '52 A10 -built from bits 'n pieces never resto intended -maybe 'personalised'
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Online beezermacc

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Re: Magneto types
« Reply #2 on: 01.05. 2018 17:49 »
KVF 50 is for a 50 degree V twin like a Vincent. It certainly won't work on an A10. It could be  converted to A10 but it would be much easier to start with the correct mag and have it fixed. The KVF is probably worth quite a bit of money if you find the right buyer. The ATD, unless someone has fitted a BSA ATD is also incorrect, wrong number of teeth and rotates the wrong way. A K2FC will work on an A10 but there is no benefit over the standard K2F. You will also find that the screwed down pickups are a disadvantage if you need to remove them. Most K2FC's are not proper K2FC's, just standard issue Triumph magnetos. The internals are the same as K2F.
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Offline wortluck

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Re: Magneto types
« Reply #3 on: 01.05. 2018 21:52 »
Cheers fellas.  Beezermacc gives a very comprehensive answer and many thanks for this.  I've come across a working KVF 50 at a good price - do you know what a working one would fetch if it comes with the correct ATD.  The K2FC was just an idea, so I'll stick with the standard K2F.  May be worthwhile knowing the internals are the same!

Online berger

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Re: Magneto types
« Reply #4 on: 01.05. 2018 22:10 »
i have not been to the pub, maybe beezermack or someone else can clear this up for me. I was told many moons ago that apart from bolt on pickups and manual retard /advance and screw on end cap the K2FC's armatures were wound with continuous wire and some of the K2Fs might have got a join in the windings? *dunno2* *conf2*

Offline Joolstacho

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Re: Magneto types
« Reply #5 on: 01.05. 2018 23:55 »
I could be wrong but I thought Lucas at one stage confirmed that the only difference between the 'C' (competition) was that it was manual advance and retard.

Online groily

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Re: Magneto types
« Reply #6 on: 02.05. 2018 07:13 »
Don't think so Jools as there are fixed C versions as well as manual (usually with the AR hole not drilled and tapped, so a blank casting that end). Main obv diff is the screw-on pick-ups, square end housing for points and camring, larger screws to retain same, bigger cb end bearing 'N3048 vs E15' (in almost all cases), end cover with breather, no holes in base of body. V easy to confuse the bog standard later offering with screw-on HT pick-ups used by Triumph etc as Beezermacc said. And plenty of mixed and matched ones out there, with or without the correct id label on.
I think there may be some truth in the winding point raised by berger, but not sure. I also heard that sometimes if there was a break on the HT winding when doing it, some mags would have a join in there, but not if it was a C. Could just be bar-room myth though, plenty of them about
The windings done these days are the same, afaik, from most winders, for all versions of K1, KV and K2F and C versions. R versions, not sure, don't see a lot except the odd KVFR version with different armature material. Early ones of those, like K2Fs generally, had 15mm bearings at the drive end.
The KVF is valuable to a Vincent owner certainly! Clockwise rotation, so different slipring from on an A, 50° so different camring, sometimes platinum points, cyl numbers stamped on the body, etc.
Bit of a minefield really, and lots of pet theories around as to what is what. Quite hard to sort it all out sometimes and I never feel 100% certain on some of the ins and outs. The Lucas Parts Lists help, but aren't light reading!
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Re: Magneto types
« Reply #7 on: 02.05. 2018 08:22 »
Wouldn’t take much to change a V twin mag to parallel twin type.

Online groily

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Re: Magneto types
« Reply #8 on: 02.05. 2018 08:58 »
Very true TT.
And if they all went anti-clockwise (I wish) it would actually be pretty easy.
Prob better to sell on a 'real' KVF though, for the premium they attract! (It's more common round here to be asked to turn a K2 into a KV to be honest, or to modify older generation single cyl mags/magdynos to work as Vs.)
Bill

Online Bsareg

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Re: Magneto types
« Reply #9 on: 02.05. 2018 09:24 »
There could be some truth in the no breaks in the winding theory. One of my first jobs when apprenticed (60 Yrs ago) was to hand lay high voltage 30kv coils. We were only allowed one break per coil and that had to be joined in a certain configuration before soldering. If the wire broke a second time, the coil was scrapped and we got a bo.......king.
C11,B40,B44 Victor,A10,RGS,M21,Rocket3,REBSA

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Re: Magneto types
« Reply #10 on: 02.05. 2018 09:30 »

 
Quote
.....Prob better to sell on a 'real' KVF though, for the premium they attract! (It's more common round here to be asked to turn a K2 into a KV to be honest, or to modify older generation single cyl mags/magdynos to work as Vs.)....

 There yea go wort-oh- you may just have a ready made market...or maybe not..  *dunno2*
Started building in about 1977/8 a on average '52 A10 -built from bits 'n pieces never resto intended -maybe 'personalised'
Have a '74 850T Moto Guzzi since '92-best thing I ever bought doesn't need a kickstart 'cos it bump starts sooooooooo(mostly) easy
Australia

Online beezermacc

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Re: Magneto types
« Reply #11 on: 04.05. 2018 10:09 »
Wouldn’t take much to change a V twin mag to parallel twin type.

You'd need to change the points, cam ring, and slip ring (assuming rotation needs to be reversed as well)
Priory Magnetos Ltd - A10 spares, magneto and dynamo refurbs. www.priorymagnetos.co.uk

Offline wortluck

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Re: Magneto types
« Reply #12 on: 11.05. 2018 19:52 »
Hi guys.  I've acquired a rather worn ATD which is complete apart from the cupped washer/ring and 'C' ring.  It also needs a new fibre wheel.  What I'm not sure about is the movable 'arms' the springs attach to which seem to have slightly enlarged holes.  There also seems to be a lot of up an down movement, although this doesn't seem to affect the operation of the bob weights.  Should I be concerned?  Do I need to replace the movable 'arms'?  Are they available and is this possible?
Sorry to ask this again but does anyone know where I could acquire the spares I need prior to Priory Magnetos (beezermacc) reopening for business in September?  Priory does them at a good price so may wait until then anyway.

Cheers