Author Topic: Pushrod problem!!  (Read 3038 times)

Offline olev

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Re: Pushrod problem!!
« Reply #15 on: 09.04. 2012 13:40 »
Hardite & casenit hey? are you decrepit old b's having fun??
probably good for piles too.
cheers

Offline chaterlea25

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Re: Pushrod problem!!
« Reply #16 on: 09.04. 2012 16:51 »
Hi Trevor,
The silver steel will harden glass hard by heating to ""cherry red"" and plunging into cold water
only redden the last 5/8in. or so
I dont know why it comes in 13 inch lengths ???? ???? ???? ????
As far as I know silver steel is referred to as "drill rod" in the USA
DO NOT USE it for spindles or in stress bearing applications

Regards
John O R
1961 Super Rocket
1963 RGS (ongoing)

Online trevinoz

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Re: Pushrod problem!!
« Reply #17 on: 09.04. 2012 22:46 »
Trevor,
               I've got a tin of the stuff which was "donated" to me probably 20 years ago.
Trev.

Online RichardL

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Re: Pushrod problem!!
« Reply #18 on: 10.04. 2012 01:08 »
Disagree,  soft ends most likely cause.  Sitting at light with clutch pulled in will not increase likelihood of mushrooming like this.  Greatest stress on ends is when clutch is activated,  not when sitting there with the pressure plate (edit: and rod) at rest. Lack of lubrication at rod end may lead to overheating and,  thus, annealing, (edit:  ...though, this is the lever end.)

Oops. Sorry, Wilco, I had a brain stoppage. Of course, pressure plate is not at rest when stopped in gear, but spinning with the rest of the driven plates. Now, a little less boldly, I still believe the problem is soft ends, or soft ends brought on by too little lubrication. I have a hunch that using the ball-bearing-in-the-middle-of-the-tunnel approach probably reduces the amount of spinning friction, at least at the lever.

Richard L.  
Plan on signing up for the world-wide 2020 DISTINGUISHED GENTLEMAN'S RIDEon September 27, 2020 (if it's not cancelled and we are free to move about by then). Watch website at https://www.gentlemansride.com for details.

Offline BSA_54A10

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Re: Pushrod problem!!
« Reply #19 on: 10.04. 2012 11:49 »
Quote
Hardite & casenit hey? are you decrepit old b's having fun??
probably good for piles too.
When men were men and shopping was something that was done when needed , not a pastime or competative sport we used to make things from scratch.
There were quite a few case hardening compounds around . Like pistons ( no spand, low spand, spandex etc, etc ) case hardening compounds had self explanatory trade names ( well some we a bit play full ).
Trouble is that they are just about all based on either cyanide or arsenic two compounds that are considered "too dangerous" for Joe public to get their hands on considering that you get 25 pages of MSDA sheets if you buy hand cleaner in 25 L drums.
Bike Beesa
Trevor

Offline chaterlea25

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Re: Pushrod problem!!
« Reply #20 on: 10.04. 2012 20:28 »
Hi All,
"Case hardening" compounds are intended for use on more or less "mild" steel components
Markus will fill us in on the exact "specifications", I have a big "Casenit" tin and the instructions are for use on "mild steel" . It will only harden an outer layer of the component
Clutch pushrods need to be hard throughout (at the ends) which is why the steel of choice is "silver steel" or drillrod
HTH
John O R
1961 Super Rocket
1963 RGS (ongoing)

Offline olev

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Re: Pushrod problem!!
« Reply #21 on: 11.04. 2012 09:56 »
To the 2 Trevs,
Apologies for the swipe about kasenit and hardite and decrepit old b's.
I should be whipped and beaten and forced to drink xxxx for thinking you were having a lend of us.
cheers.

Offline duTch

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Re: Pushrod problem!!
« Reply #22 on: 11.04. 2012 13:24 »
Nothin' wrong with xxxx,*grins* *fight* got one on the go right now, you should be made to drink it for the swipe about it!!
     *beer* 
Started building in about 1977/8 a on average '52 A10 -built from bits 'n pieces never resto intended -maybe 'personalised'
Have a '74 850T Moto Guzzi since '92-best thing I ever bought doesn't need a kickstart 'cos it bump starts sooooooooo(mostly) easy
Australia

Offline BSA_54A10

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Re: Pushrod problem!!
« Reply #23 on: 12.04. 2012 22:00 »
Quote
"Case hardening" compounds are intended for use on more or less "mild" steel components
Markus will fill us in on the exact "specifications", I have a big "Casenit" tin and the instructions are for use on "mild steel" . It will only harden an outer layer of the component
Clutch pushrods need to be hard throughout (at the ends) which is why the steel of choice is "silver steel" or drillrod

The entire end does not need to be through hard,
If it is cased all over then the pressure plate / clutch lever will be pushing against a hard surface because the end will also be hard and will see no difference between a cased end and a fully hardened end provided that they are hardened to the same level.
The depth of hardening depends totally on how long you soak. Leave them in it for long enough and you can get through hardening of thin sections.

You can use these compounds on any grade of steel although the lower the carbon content the better it works.
the higher the carbon content the longer you need to soak in the salts and of course eventually you get to a point where the cost of holding the part at temperature is greater than the cost of using a higher strength grade of steel in the first place. Or if you are not careful and overheat end up with recrystalization and large grain growth which is not good.

The only real difference between using a cased rod and a through hardened rod is that the cased rod needs to be cased all the way back to the point where it exits the mainshaft or it might bend.

Usually you case an item that is hard to fabricate so that you can machine it while soft & easy to do then harden it latter.
Bike Beesa
Trevor

Offline pedrochapala

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Re: Pushrod problem!!
« Reply #24 on: 13.04. 2012 04:15 »
i don't understand. i've had the same rod in for 16 years and nothing has happened to it.