Author Topic: making solid copper head gasket...will any kind of copper do ???  (Read 9417 times)

Offline JulianM

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Imagine how "Bling" it would be if you polished it!

Julian  *smile*
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Offline BSA_54A10

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FCC = Face centered cubic which is the pattern that the atoms make.
Remember all those ping pong balls glued together in high school ?
The metals that have a FCC structure tend to be the easiest to deform.

Aluminium work hardens just the same as copper only more so and for the same reasons.
Unfortunately it also age hardens ( precipitation hardens to be accurate )
All aluminium comes with a specific temper, usually shown as T 1 to T 6
For something like a head gasket you would heat to 250 to 300 deg C then allow to cool
In the home, about 10 minutes in the oven should do the job unless "she" catches you in the kitchen.
It gets a lot trickier with alloys like cast wheels for instance Ap 601 T4 which is why I would never use a wheel that I knew has been damaged & repaired as no one down here has the gear to properly soften the wheels then reharden them after being straightened.
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Trevor

Offline duTch

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thanks Trev, good stuff to know, but I don't think I'll be acting on it having done my one gasket art piece. :! (But will keep it for emergencies, it did work ok before, and I did anneal it too, way back then)
 you must've gone to a fairly flash high school to get atomic pingpong balls glued together *smile*

 Wasn't there a Velocette or something that also was famous for a bronze head?
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Started building in about 1977/8 a on average '52 A10 -built from bits 'n pieces never resto intended -maybe 'personalised'
Have a '74 850T Moto Guzzi since '92-best thing I ever bought doesn't need a kickstart 'cos it bump starts sooooooooo(mostly) easy
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Toby

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Apparently this makes no difference to copper so I'm told, thinking about a little more Quecnhing is normally used to harden metal not what's wanted with copper(I'm open to correction on this guys) - bound to be metallurgist on the forum""

You treat Copper in the opposite manner as steel.
If you want to soften steel, heat it red hot then let it cool.
If you want to soften Copper heat until red hot then immediately plunge into water.
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Offline BSA_54A10

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Toby.

Not quite correct.
To harden you are trying to trap a crystal structure ( called a phase ) some where that it would not normally exist so you are stopping a high temperature phase ( or phases depending upon the actual alloy ) reverting to what it should be at room temperature , thus you usually quench.
When you anneal you heat up the metal just enough to supply enough energy to allow the strains to unwind.
Think of it like having a "sore back " from doing too much hard work ( work hardening ).
you relieve the sore muscles by applying heat to allow them to unwind ( allow the lactic acid to dissipate ) the rate of cooling is unimportant.
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Trevor

Toby

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Toby comments.:- I stand by what I said, if you wish to soften copper to make an efficient head gasket then heat it until just cherry red then submege in water.
If you wish to soften steel just heat it up until dull red then let it cool in still air.

I note your comments regarding annealing, but in my Industry, (Pipeline Steel), we use a lower temperature for stress relief heat treatment than the steel annealing temperature.
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Offline JulianM

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Toby,

Simple answer for you.

Just try it!

Standard "Red Copper" from a dull red will be soft.  Quenched or not!  same with ally when you anneal it, quench it or not, it's still soft for quite some time!

Both of them "work" and "age" harden though.

Julian.
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55 Ariel HS mk1,
58 BSA Super Rocket Scrambler special,
60 BSA Gold Star, Jim hunter desert racer,
64 Norton N15CS,
65 Triumph TR6 SS,
66 Triumph Bonneville,
71 AJS Stormer,
71 BSA Rocket 3,
71 Laverda 750SF,
71 Laverda/Egli 750SF, Race bike,
73 Norton Commando 850,
74 Moto Morini 3-1/2 Sport,
74 Bultaco Sherpa 350,
76 Beta Cross 50,
77 Moto Guzzi Le Mans Mk1,
80 Ducati 900 MHR,