Author Topic: Bike cutting out mystery  (Read 836 times)

Offline BSA500

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Bike cutting out mystery
« on: 21.10. 2022 13:30 »
Ok hopefully a bit of a brain teaser. I didn't post this to electrics/fuel because I just don't know.

1. taking the bike to work,topped up the fuel(unleaded). Done about 6 miles and when I pulled up to the junction it stopped. Would not start called recovery, well at this point I realised I had left my phone and tools at home. Kind man let me use his phone. Recovery didn't turn up 2 hours later so tried to start again and she did, running rough but ran for home(btw recovery couldn't find me and tried calling me on a phone I told them I didn't have with me *sad2*)
Checked her over and found some crap in the filters,cleaned out tank/taps/filter and stripped and cleaned carb.
2. Rode to work again 13 miles ok, a bit vibratory. Went to go home got 100yards and did it again. This time ten minutes later restarts and ride home.
 Now if it was doing this everytime it was hot then yep I would say mag. I will add checked the mag,leads/plug caps/points/spark plugs but to be honest both plugs wouldn't quit at the same time unless it was the mag but once restarted seems to run fine.
 I will be taking the engine down this winter to replace the rings(burning oil, I have a leakdown tester to check the whole engine) and a helicoil and perhaps why she vibrates at the moment.
So I am at your mercy bring it on and thanks

1960 A7 (57 motor to SS spec)

Online Bsareg

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Re: Bike cutting out mystery
« Reply #1 on: 21.10. 2022 13:45 »
Sounds a lot like capacitor failing.
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Offline Topdad

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Re: Bike cutting out mystery
« Reply #2 on: 21.10. 2022 14:14 »
Quite a few yrs ago I had something similar happen. I'm a weekend warrior so Saturday bike out for a run and she'd start first time and ride normally for approx 2 miles ,then at a setr of lights (always the same set ) she'd stop,wouldn't start I'd push her out of the road try again to kick her over and she'd be away I'd do a fair run ,5o miles not a burp, next week the same .Come winter Mag of sent to a wizzard who serviced and fitted a new cap ,no trouble since ,thats 10 yrs .
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Offline BSA500

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Re: Bike cutting out mystery
« Reply #3 on: 21.10. 2022 14:32 »
Yeah, to be fair I am leaning towards mag as the carb does tend to fade on you, like running out of fuel, rather than stop dead. Capacitors can be as random as this?. It was rebuilt by Priory mags in the last 5 ish years so its not an 'old type'

1960 A7 (57 motor to SS spec)

Offline BSA500

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Re: Bike cutting out mystery
« Reply #4 on: 21.10. 2022 14:44 »
Mag rebuilt 2017

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Offline CheeserBeezer

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Re: Bike cutting out mystery
« Reply #5 on: 21.10. 2022 19:28 »
Andrew here from Priory Magnetos! Obviously I would like a rebuilt magneto to give years of trouble-free riding but, given the way our bikes are used and stored, the magneto has a harder life than it would if it were used on a regular basis. There are all sorts of issues to do with condensation etc. I rebuild about 100 magnetos per year and I guess I get, literally, one or two back where something has gone wrong. Magnetos which have been in regular use for a reasonable period of time, say two years or more, and have been functioning well sometimes seem to lose their 'joie de vivre' and don't perform as well as they used to. Some owners overlook the fact that a magneto needs maintenance; I make this point generally and not specific to this thread though it may be a factor. Everybody in the Cheshire Branch of the BSAOC has one of my rebuilt magnetos on their bike, so I feel a massive weight of responsibility every time we go out on a ride and, once in a blue moon, something goes wrong, even on my own bike! Back in the day nearly every village would have a person who knew his way round a magneto and come out and fix a minor problem. This is no longer the case, and if my mates were completely honest they would say that they don't touch their magnetos from one year to the next because I'm on the end of the phone, can lend them a mag or fix theirs or whatever! The point I'm making is that a magneto needs to be properly serviced, ideally every riding season. This does not mean that it needs to be sent to the 'Magwizzard' but it does mean that an interested owner will learn how to do it himself. Everything that can be checked needs to be checked. Here's a list which is not exhaustive.... Spark plugs - clean, gapped, renewed if it helps; Ht leads and plug caps - zero resistance from cap to split washer in pickup, clean and dry and undamaged; Pickups- clean, undamaged, decent quality, minimal resistance though the brush to the split washer contact, good quality brushes, springs checked so the brush contacts the slip ring, brushes free in their slots; slip ring - clean and resistance through to body of about 5k ohms assuming earth brush is OK; earth brush- free in pod and spring functioning correctly, zero resistance through brush and body; earth track on armature- clean, dry, free from any oil or grease residue; armature- no endfloat or vertical play; points- clean, dry, gapped, continuity and resistance checked when open and closed..... and there's more!! The majority of problems I have with magnetos I have built and have been running for several years is dirty earth tracks and earth brushes - worth checking a few times each year. Problems with the windings and/or capacitor are virtually non-existent. The list I have provided looks like a hell of a lot of work but it really isn't. You don't have to take the magneto off the bike and it can all be achieved in less than an hour unless you encounter a problem.

Offline RDfella

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Re: Bike cutting out mystery
« Reply #6 on: 21.10. 2022 19:47 »
Quote
a magneto needs to be properly serviced, ideally every riding season.

Not sure I agree with that. The one part of a machine that should be 'fit and forget' is surely the magneto? Sure, check the points gap now and again, but 'service'? The mag (BTH) on my B31 hasn't been touched since I fitted new bearings 50+ yrs ago. The mag on my M21V2 (same as A10 except 50* camring) hasn't been serviced since it was fitted 30 yrs ago. The mag on a 250gpm water pump I have hasn't been touched since it was built in the 50's. And all are working just fine, same as others I have. I'm inclined to suspect the quality of replacement parts (brushes, capacitors etc) is the problem these days rather than lack of servicing.
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Re: Bike cutting out mystery
« Reply #7 on: 21.10. 2022 20:13 »
Its definitely worth checking the fuel side, in my experience a blocked fuel cap vent can cause a pretty sudden stop, as can a blocked float bowl vent (tickler). Depending on how full your tank is alters how far you will get with a blocked fuel cap vent. Obviously jets and air passages need checking/cleaning as well.

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Offline CheeserBeezer

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Re: Bike cutting out mystery
« Reply #8 on: 21.10. 2022 21:24 »
Quote
a magneto needs to be properly serviced, ideally every riding season.

Not sure I agree with that. The one part of a machine that should be 'fit and forget' is surely the magneto? Sure, check the points gap now and again, but 'service'? The mag (BTH) on my B31 hasn't been touched since I fitted new bearings 50+ yrs ago. The mag on my M21V2 (same as A10 except 50* camring) hasn't been serviced since it was fitted 30 yrs ago. The mag on a 250gpm water pump I have hasn't been touched since it was built in the 50's. And all are working just fine, same as others I have. I'm inclined to suspect the quality of replacement parts (brushes, capacitors etc) is the problem these days rather than lack of servicing.
What you say is, generally, correct. and an endorsement of magnetos. Most magnetos don't need touching for a number of years, as my mates would testify. However, the list I gave is a list of things an owner could or might do to preempt problems, or on buying a new bike, or investigating a misfire, for instance. These things are worth checking if the bike has been left standing for a while, particularly over winter in a damp garage. Some fastidious owners will do this but, you're right, most of us don't! On the rare occasion a magneto is returned to me, invariably the fault lies within the list I've given. I occasionally change an armature as a precaution but I've never actually had a modern capacitor fail. If owners never service their magnetos they will fail eventually as a consequence of lack of maintenance.

Offline BSA500

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Re: Bike cutting out mystery
« Reply #9 on: 21.10. 2022 23:04 »
Thanks Andrew plenty of checking over while I have the lump out. It does get used alot on summer and good days in winter, but I have been ill the last year. It won't kill me and I will get there but vertigo does tend to stop the riding. I hope it's not a serious problem but on the fuel side the carb was stripped and ultrasound cleaned, new taps, lines flushed and fuel cap vent cleaned. I know the slip ring is clean pick ups, leads and caps checked and new plugs this year gapped etc

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Offline mugwump

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Re: Bike cutting out mystery
« Reply #10 on: 22.10. 2022 13:36 »
I don't believe in filters on an old fuel tanks ( unless scrupulously cleaned ) taps as they can continually block. Not an easy or satisfactory road-side fix. Better off with just an additional filter on the fuel line. 

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Online Triton Thrasher

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Re: Bike cutting out mystery
« Reply #11 on: 22.10. 2022 14:19 »
I don't believe in filters on an old fuel tanks ( unless scrupulously cleaned ) taps as they can continually block. Not an easy or satisfactory road-side fix. Better off with just an additional filter on the fuel line.

Yes, I remove the gauzes.  An inline paper element filter can be big enough never to clog and you can see into it anyway.

Offline BSA500

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Re: Bike cutting out mystery
« Reply #12 on: 22.10. 2022 16:53 »
Checking flow is easy enough also when the bike runs dry it tend to fluff about and slow to a halt. This just stops dead. Each time I undone the cap and checked if she would flood on the tickler, she did. I also removed the mag points cover to eliminate the cut out

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Re: Bike cutting out mystery
« Reply #13 on: 23.10. 2022 20:13 »
Checking flow is easy enough also when the bike runs dry it tend to fluff about and slow to a halt. This just stops dead. Each time I undone the cap and checked if she would flood on the tickler, she did. I also removed the mag points cover to eliminate the cut out

Another “long shot” is whether the float is sticking on the (monoblocs) cover, an often left out spacer prevents this happening.

I did not diagnose the blocked float vent on my monobloc until I replaced the cover with cling film held in place with a rubber band and watched it fill up (or not in my case). The carb flooded using the tickler but fuel did not come out the tickler, but the needle jet instead (I think).
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Online Jules

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Re: Bike cutting out mystery
« Reply #14 on: 27.10. 2022 23:50 »
Question - is the weather a factor in this?? I've mentioned before that my old 60's A7 used to just stop (and wouldn't start) when it rained, then later start and run perfectly (til it rained again!)