Replacement Engines in the 60’s

[Terryb]

Has anyone any knowledge of how exchange engines, say under warranty period during the 60’s was handled. Especially how engine numbers were stamped? I’m repairing a 1961 BSA A10 SR and when applying for a darting certificate it appears that the font on the engine case number is incorrect according to the Dating Service for the BSAOC.

[limeyrob]

Rather casually I suspect.  In the early 70s - OK when BSA were already in trouble - I took an A65 engine to the Small Heath Service Dept for repair.  You just parked up outside the factory doors and walked in and met someone in a workshop coat.  They made some notes on a pad and took the engine away.  I seem to recall there was a metal work bench that you put your engine on and the workshop was behind some swing doors.  We were told to come back in 3 days which we did and the engine was ready to pick up.  I think it had a new bottom end and the bill was £36.  It was all had written on a Kalamazoo pad  I appreciate this was not a replacement engine but the whole process was very "old fashioned" and not at all organised.
I also drive a 1970 Land Rover and a number of us are struggling with the numbers on factory replacement engines and gearboxes.  The answer seems to be that while there was a procedure, whether the part ever actually got stamped seems pot luck.  Also updating of the log book would most likely be by hand on the Green Log Book and witnessed at a local DVLA office.  I suspect many owners did not bother.
Land Rover supplies replacement chassis and I gather in the 60s it was not uncommon to get them blank with a note to "stamp the numbers on", I suspect BSA were no different.
I would be wary if the font is wrong. It was quite common to re stamp engines or remove numbers.  Before opening a can of worms examine the case very carefully.  I recently bought an A10 n e-bay only to be told it the frame had no numbers and the reg was missing. I canceled the deal as they had obviously been filed off.
Of course this is BSA so its quite possible the workshop had a different set of stamps to the production line

[Greybeard]

In the late 1960's my sister and boyfriend had an MGB;  the engine was knackered. They knew someone who knew someone who worked at Longbridge motor-works. Money changed hands. A few days later a replacement engine, still on its factory delivery pallet arrived via the back door of the factory .

This sort of loose accounting was typical back then and must have contributed to the demise of British industry. It may be that BSA had a flourishing back-door trade as well.

[Joolstacho]

There was the odd foreigner that snuck out the back of the factory with no number I'm sure.
I believe the routine for a blown engine was that the BSA Dealer would get the blown cases from the unlucky customer, order new cases from the factory, then stamp the new cases with the same number.

[sean]

I rebuilt a blown up bonneville engine in the early 70s ordered a set of new cases from the dealer they were blank you just stamped the old numbers on the case ........dont know if it was the same with BSA

[RichardL]

In the late 1960's my sister and boyfriend had an MGB

GB.

This is an interesting statement. I'm confused, but not judging. 

Richard L.

[Joolstacho]

There's no accounting for tastes nowadays eh Richard!

[Swarfcut]

  Strange that someone is concerned about the Font. My experience is that if the number matches the paperwork then authority is satisfied. If the bike is not what it appears, then yes, obvious cause for concern and after all these years there is always scope for skullduggary.....The more desirable model being the obvious one to fake.

  As GB relates, it was a little different back then and the informal rules stuck to by working folks ensured that backs were scratched, everyone got a piece of the action and the hookey stuff they wanted. The top bosses still enjoyed their champagne lifestyle. It sort of levelled the playing field. It was known in the West Midlands as a Perk From Work and and the stock losses only represented the material cost...Er,well, maybe.

 Swarfy.

[Greybeard]

In the late 1960's my sister and boyfriend had an MGB

GB.

This is an interesting statement. I'm confused, but not judging. 

Richard L.

Yeh OK, 'my sister and her boyfriend'

[rocker21]

I know that when a new frame was ordered for a bike (a10) that had been in an accident the frame came without numbers and an instruction to copy the old frame numbers which was done but we did not have the same stamps as the factory used but no one was bothered back then, this was done at a local BSA dealer back in the 60's  and i know of another dealer that did not bother with stamping the new frame, just did the repair and gave it back to the the owner.
when i went to the international BSA owners club rally in Italy in the early 70's an A65 engine went bang in a big way and a new engine was flown out and fitted, the rally was organized by the local BSA club and the importer not sure if it had engine no's on it.

[Topdad]

I can confirm that our workshop ( bsa maindealer ) did have number punches band the cases were supposed to be updated as the originals in fact I remember seeing Ted gatskil the workshop boss stamping cases the set being kept in is office  but everytime who knows !!
Re exchange engines or short motors BMC supplied the "gold "and they were stamped butbthe new owner was supposed to inform the tax office etc

[Greybeard]

BMC supplied the "gold "...

Yes, you've reminded me, my sisters MGB engine was painted gold!

[Terryb]

Ok guys thanks for the comments. It appears that the current engine possibly came drone a different bike, even though the last previous owner’s didn’t know. I’m guessing that BSA pre-stamped the prefix, such as DA10R or GA7SS and then added the sequential number later. Anyway it looks like this bike is becoming a Bitsa and dropping in value🥴

Thanks again👍

[Rex]

  Strange that someone is concerned about the Font. My experience is that if the number matches the paperwork then authority is satisfied.
 Swarfy.

Mine's the opposite. Try getting a dating letter from a club etc with a modern metric font  stamped frame. The club experts know what to look for regarding authenticity.
As they say, they have to be scrupulous thanks to the shenanigans of the number plate dealers some years back, and those who wish for their boggo A10 to really be an RGS..

[jjbsa]

In 1963 I was building up an RGS engine and found the drive side main had been spinning in the crancase.  I drove in my father's car to the customer service department at Armoury Road and the guy at the counter took it away and 10 minutes later returned with a pair of new crankcases with the drive side one stamped the same as the original, and charged me just for half the price of the a pair of cases.  I still have that lovely old bike.  Customer service! 

While I was there a French guy turned up on an almosr new RGS and we had a good chat.  BSA's spares and exchange scheme was much appreciated in those days. 

On the same trip, I took my brother to the Velocette factory for some parts he needed, where is was known the guys at the counter could take ages to reappear with the parts you wanted.  There were message scribed on the wall about this.  One of them was "I died here".   

Those were the days!