Author Topic: LED Info & Electrickery  (Read 871 times)

Offline RogerSB

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LED Info & Electrickery
« on: 16.12. 2019 13:26 »
GB kindly suggested I start a new topic with this information about fitting LEDs to our BSAs.

https://www.jlclassics.com/phdi/p1.nsf/supppages/jlc?opendocument&part=13

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Online RDfella

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Re: LED Info & Electrickery
« Reply #1 on: 16.12. 2019 16:15 »
Unless fitted ‘for fun’ I fail to see the point of fitting LED bulbs to a motorcycle. If incandescent bulbs are fitted and lit, cost in fuel to power them would be around a half penny an hour. Unless one is a night-time despatch rider, the next ice age will be upon us before any financial benefit would be reaped.
And talking of finances, how much does a LED bulb cost compared with an incandescent one? And how long do the LEDs last? Salesmen tell us practically forever, but if my torches (flashlight in USA) are anything to go by, not so long at all. Which, given their greater electronic complexity compared with incandescent, doesn’t surprise me. And then there’s the light quality. Frankly, I find the light from a white LED irritating. It’s just too cold and white. And the light never seems spread out enough. Street lighting is one example, where instead of floodlighting the area, they act like a row of spotlights. You tend to get a similar situation to driving along a road lined with trees during bright sunshine. Dark, bright, dark etc. Seems to me, in urban areas at least, that’s a danger as a pedestrian or cyclist could be almost unseen when in the dark area.
More expensive, more to go wrong so, unless fitted for energy economy (eg streetlights) I can’t see the attraction. Just my TPW.
'49 B31, '49 M21, '53 DOT, '58 Flash, '00 Firestorm, Weslake sprint bike.

Offline RogerSB

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Re: LED Info & Electrickery
« Reply #2 on: 16.12. 2019 17:07 »
Unless fitted ‘for fun’ I fail to see the point of fitting LED bulbs to a motorcycle. If incandescent bulbs are fitted and lit, cost in fuel to power them would be around a half penny an hour. Unless one is a night-time despatch rider, the next ice age will be upon us before any financial benefit would be reaped.

 *conf2*  It's not about any sort of financial benefit, it's about keeping the Ah low for the battery.

Speaking for myself, I only use my A10 for pleasure these days and as the throttle isn't wide open most of the time the regulator doesn't always cut in to charge the battery, even with a DVR2 fitted. The main advantage is, I believe,  for the stop light, which is continually on and off - whenever or wherever you ride. The benefit of fitting LEDs is that they consume very, very low amps.  I wouldn't fit or recommend them for a headlight but good for a bright daytime running pilot light.

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Offline muskrat

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Re: LED Info & Electrickery
« Reply #3 on: 16.12. 2019 18:49 »
G'day Roger.
Like RD I can't see the point with a magneto ignited bike that only does daytime or occasional night ride home from the pub.
I can see the advantage for both my electronic ignited A7/10's but in the last year have only ridden home from the pub once (that I remember).
Cheers
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Offline RoyC

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Re: LED Info & Electrickery
« Reply #4 on: 16.12. 2019 19:23 »
G'day Roger.
Like RD I can't see the point with a magneto ignited bike that only does daytime or occasional night ride home from the pub.
I can see the advantage for both my electronic ignited A7/10's but in the last year have only ridden home from the pub once (that I remember).
Cheers


Don't you use your headlight as a DRL ?
My bike is a 1958 A7SS
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Offline RogerSB

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Re: LED Info & Electrickery
« Reply #5 on: 16.12. 2019 19:42 »
G'day Roger.
Like RD I can't see the point with a magneto ignited bike that only does daytime or occasional night ride home from the pub.
I can see the advantage for both my electronic ignited A7/10's but in the last year have only ridden home from the pub once (that I remember).
Cheers

Hi Musky, I can appreciate your point (up to a point) but up until a couple of years ago, before I fitted a DVR2 and changed to LEDs more than a few times, when riding home in the dusk or dark I needed lights and very quickly the headlight faded to a glimmer. Ok if you can keep going but not too good in the traffic and in a town. I do only ride for pleasure these days but I also ride a lot, during the summer and winter, and here in the UK a lot of the time, with our inclement weather, it's wise to switch your lights on even during the day.

Some years ago when I rode my A10 as daily transport and riding 350 miles nearly every weekend from the barracks on Friday evening to Plymouth and back again over night on Sunday when serving in the marines there was never a problem with charging (that was on 6V). Nor was there ever a problem with wet sumping.

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Online mikeb

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Re: LED Info & Electrickery
« Reply #6 on: 16.12. 2019 20:18 »
my A and my B both (with magnetos) have 4000 lumen LEDs on the front with the main purpose of being visible in day light hours - high beam or low. Bright LED at the rear too.  its defensive.  they are 'good enough' at night and waaayyy better than the original 6v 35W incandescent. probably not as good as a 12v 60W halogen - the LEDs have a 'thinner' light. but the LEDs won't melt my dynamo and the battery never goes flat.

Unless you have an alternator/athlon with more power, I would recommend them for a headlight, just dont buy rubbish LEDs. they are definitely more expensive
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Offline RogerSB

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Re: LED Info & Electrickery
« Reply #7 on: 16.12. 2019 20:42 »
my A and my B both (with magnetos) have 4000 lumen LEDs on the front with the main purpose of being visible in day light hours - high beam or low. Bright LED at the rear too.  its defensive.  they are 'good enough' at night and waaayyy better than the original 6v 35W incandescent. probably not as good as a 12v 60W halogen - the LEDs have a 'thinner' light. but the LEDs won't melt my dynamo and the battery never goes flat.

Unless you have an alternator/athlon with more power, I would recommend them for a headlight, just dont buy rubbish LEDs. they are definitely more expensive

Hi Mike, I have a 12W British Pre Focus Quartz Halogen 35/35W (from P Goff) for my headlight, which uses 2.92Ah.  The rest are LEDs (Oh! except the speedo bulb now). I can't imagine riding at night today with only a 6V 30/24W like I did ** years ago.

When serving in the Royal Marines I rode my GF from Plymouth to Portsmouth over night on a Sunday nearly every weekend for a year. It took about 6 hours and I had to be on parade , bright, smart and shiny, at 7.30 am in the morning. In those days, here in the SW of England, there were no motorways (the nearest now is 50 miles away), only a few dual carriageways when you got near Southampton, the roads were mostly winding, narrow two lane roads. Mind you 100% eyesight then and didn't get cramp when riding!

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Offline duTch

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Re: LED Info & Electrickery
« Reply #8 on: 16.12. 2019 23:22 »
 RD, as Roger says, on our bikes it's about conservation of amps- at least on everything other than the headlight which has more available amps to fed it....I don't disagree with you on the other stuff but not so relevant here except;
 
Quote
..... Frankly, I find the light from a white LED irritating. It’s just too cold and white .....
I'm sure you mean white as opposed to red or other colour and are aware that 'white' comes in a range of spectrum from warm yellow to cold white 2K to ~6K .... just to be clear  :! Maybe headlight LED's need to be more yellow (I hate those blueish ones too)
  *beer*

 
Quote
......for my headlight, which uses 2.92Ah.....

 I'm sure you mean 2.92A (unless it took an hour to measure *smile*)
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Re: LED Info & Electrickery
« Reply #9 on: 17.12. 2019 00:50 »
Quote
Mind you 100% eyesight then
yes Roger, that's definitely a thing for me too. Also the light that other vehicles are emitting has gone up 10 fold. its an arms race to be seen and to see.
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Online Black Sheep

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Re: LED Info & Electrickery
« Reply #10 on: 17.12. 2019 06:15 »
I have yet to find an LED headlight bulb that actually illuminates the road in front of you. Road signs, verges, oncoming traffic yes but the actual bit you want to see, no.
All in favour of LED stop/tail bulbs but that's all. I still do a fair bit of night riding and A7 and A10 both have BPF bulbs which are fine. My bikes are just normal daily transport, not playthings so have to be practical and usable.
Don't really see the point of minimising current draw from the dynamo. If you have 60 watts to use, why not use them?
In a somewhat damp climate, I rather like the fact that incandescent bulbs give off heart and help keep the instruments and reflector dry. 
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Offline duTch

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Re: LED Info & Electrickery
« Reply #11 on: 17.12. 2019 06:43 »
 
Quote
.......... Also the light that other vehicles are emitting has gone up 10 fold. its an arms race to be seen and to see. ....
Including knobs with gazillion LED  lightbars pushing sunlight.... *eek*

 
Quote
......... Road signs, verges, oncoming traffic yes but the actual bit you want to see, no. .....
It's handy seeing those bits to not need to wave a hand n front of the light to check it's on, but
Quote
......I have yet to find an LED headlight bulb that actually illuminates the road in front of you.....
....having only been on a major back road a couple of times on early winter mornings, any oncoming traffic did seem to push the light back into the battery,  *conf2* but was otherwise ok...
 
Quote
.....Don't really see the point of minimising current draw from the dynamo. If you have 60 watts to use, why not use them?..
Maybe if you able to ride at a speed where the revd keep up with it, but crap around town....
 
Quote
......In a somewhat damp climate, I rather like the fact that incandescent bulbs give off heart and help keep the instruments and reflector dry.  ..

 So now we need a 💓 emotoconjob just for you?   (that came up unintended as a suggestion)  *smile*
 
 LED's do actually give of a lot of ** heat ** ...  *eek*


Started building in about 1977/8 a on average '52 A10 -built from bits 'n pieces never resto intended -maybe 'personalised'
Have a '74 850T Moto Guzzi since '92-best thing I ever bought doesn't need a kickstart 'cos it bump starts sooooooooo(mostly) easy
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Online Greybeard

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Re: LED Info & Electrickery
« Reply #12 on: 17.12. 2019 10:06 »
'oncoming traffic did seem to push the light back into the battery'

Thank you for that duTch  *smile*

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Re: LED Info & Electrickery
« Reply #13 on: 17.12. 2019 10:25 »
Shouldn't have to rev the nuts off the bike to balance the headlight - something wrong there.
A throwback to the days of photons falling off the bulb, trickling off the reflector onto the mudguard and occasionally hitting the tyre and being flung a few feet in front of the bike.
All the road tests claim (accurately) that the dynamo should balance the lights at 30mph in top. If not, why not?
I do like LED stop/tails as you can sit with the brake light on as long as you like. Essential if you are at the back of a traffic queue in the dark.   
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Re: LED Info & Electrickery
« Reply #14 on: 17.12. 2019 13:29 »
Like Black Sheep I don't understand the argument about having to rev the bike to keep up with the lights. A fast tickover should be sufficient. Is it perhaps that these people have changed to 12v but are expecting the original dynamo to cut in at normal revs?
'49 B31, '49 M21, '53 DOT, '58 Flash, '00 Firestorm, Weslake sprint bike.