Author Topic: Wet sumping  (Read 2497 times)

Offline BSA_54A10

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Re: Wet sumping
« Reply #15 on: 28.04. 2018 14:08 »
The scavenge pipe can only drop the volume of the pipe into the sump unless the oil level is about the hole in the standpipe.

The usual culprit is a heavy had seating the ball into the cases distorting the seat.
The solution is as Musky does a ball braised onto the end of a rod and some very careful linishing with Brasso followed by some very thorough cleaning.
Bike Beesa
Trevor

Offline muskrat

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Re: Wet sumping
« Reply #16 on: 28.04. 2018 14:53 »
Wrong way round Trevor. I'm the heavy fisted one who taps the ball against the seat, RichardL is the lapper.
What happens is the oil seeps through the oil pump gears or gap from rubbing the end plate/extension housing. It then comes against the anti siphon ball. If it doesn't seat the oil oozes into the cases via the main bush.
Cheers
'51 A7 plunger, '57 A7SS now A10CR, '76 XT500, '77 AG175 '83 CB1100F, '81 CB900F project.
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Online A10 JWO

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Re: Wet sumping
« Reply #17 on: 28.04. 2018 15:55 »
Sorry to jump in here, did wet sumping ever stop on the later models up until the demise of BSA. I had a 1971 Commando for a few years, never had this problem regardless of how long it was laid up in the garage. If I did it must have been minimal. ? Thanks.

Online groily

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Re: Wet sumping
« Reply #18 on: 28.04. 2018 16:41 »
Maybe the Commandos had bigger better balls or something, but my Notrun Atlas and 650 Dommie engines wet-sump summat awful, with known-good guts. For better or worse they've got taps with mag cut outs. Same as my AMC twins, which are notoriously evil on this. Uprated and modded pumps can help at a price, but not guaranteed in my experience with the AMCs . Maybe the Norvil etc replacement pumps do a better job for Notruns like SRM ones are said to do for us here.   

My A, though, hasn't misbehaved at all since replacing the ball and spring. Before, it was very unpredictable.
When bikes were daily transport they didn't have a chance to embarrass themselves, though, so we never really knew I don't think! Whether, for example, later A50s and A65s were better or worse, I don't know, because the ones I knew back in the day were all daily riders. I very rarely see the unit twins hereabouts. Folk prefer the pre-units (there be loads of 'em), or maybe the unit ones just weren't imported here in any numbers.
Bill

Offline BSA500

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Re: Wet sumping
« Reply #19 on: 28.04. 2018 16:49 »
Well tiigthing the pump studs seems to have done the trick about 50 mls after 24 hours.😁

Offline muskrat

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Re: Wet sumping
« Reply #20 on: 28.04. 2018 20:49 »
That's good news BSA500.
All the little tips and tricks are worth remembering, and hopefully anyone having the same problem can work their way through them.
At least our bikes have a sump plate that can be removed to drain the sump. HD's don't and quite often make a hell of a mess pumping it out the breather. One on my bench at the moment. *rant*
Cheers
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Offline BSA_54A10

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Re: Wet sumping
« Reply #21 on: 29.04. 2018 08:16 »
Wrong way round Trevor. I'm the heavy fisted one who taps the ball against the seat, RichardL is the lapper.
What happens is the oil seeps through the oil pump gears or gap from rubbing the end plate/extension housing. It then comes against the anti siphon ball. If it doesn't seat the oil oozes into the cases via the main bush.
Cheers

Appologies to Richard & Musky.
I am down with a heavy cold courtsey of too much red too late in the morning at the ABR and the head is a bit woosey.
But at least it shows that I do take in others better ideas that are profferred here.
Bike Beesa
Trevor

Offline BSA_54A10

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Re: Wet sumping
« Reply #22 on: 29.04. 2018 08:18 »
Sorry to jump in here, did wet sumping ever stop on the later models up until the demise of BSA. I had a 1971 Commando for a few years, never had this problem regardless of how long it was laid up in the garage. If I did it must have been minimal. ? Thanks.
Commandos & Triumphs had piston pumps and wet sumping is as previously mentioned a problem with riders who do not use bikes with gear pumps enough.
Bike Beesa
Trevor

Online bsa-bill

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Re: Wet sumping
« Reply #23 on: 29.04. 2018 11:58 »
Quote
wet sumping is as previously mentioned a problem with riders who do not use bikes with gear pumps enough

Exactly
BSA produced bikes intended for regular use, had they foseen that half a century on people like us would cherish, polish and occasionally ride them now and then they would probably have addressed the problem.

This son of the soil rode his bike several times a week in the sixties, only once did it wet sump, that being after a solid month harvesting 12 - 18 hours a day, no riding , no beer not much sleep either
All the best - Bill
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Online duTch

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Re: Wet sumping
« Reply #24 on: 29.04. 2018 13:30 »

 
Quote
.... no riding , no beer....
   = no life... $$$/££££...   *eek*
Started building in about 1977/8 a on average '52 A10 -built from bits 'n pieces never resto intended -maybe 'personalised'
Have a '74 850T Moto Guzzi since '92-best thing I ever bought doesn't need a kickstart 'cos it bump starts sooooooooo(mostly) easy
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Online bsa-bill

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Re: Wet sumping
« Reply #25 on: 29.04. 2018 17:13 »
Quote
  no riding , no beer...  = no life... $$$/££££..

True but lots a cash to spend on riding and beer later (we country lads were not awash with the moola, hence the wellies and seaboot socks instead of flying boots)
All the best - Bill
1961 Flash - stock, reliable, steady, fantastic for shopping
1959 Rocket Gold Flash - blinged and tarted up  would have seizure if taken to  Tesco

Offline BSA500

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Re: Wet sumping
« Reply #26 on: 29.04. 2018 20:21 »
At least it didn't involve another strip down. I think I might have cried  *sad2*. Thanks for all the advice lots of info for all  *smile*

Online morris

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Re: Wet sumping
« Reply #27 on: 29.04. 2018 21:16 »
BSA produced bikes intended for regular use, had they foseen that half a century on people like us would cherish, polish and occasionally ride them now and then they would probably have addressed the problem.

I think they'd mainly be rolling on the floor laughing...  *smile*
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Online trevinoz

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Re: Wet sumping
« Reply #28 on: 29.04. 2018 22:33 »
Commandos & Triumphs had piston pumps and wet sumping is as previously mentioned a problem with riders who do not use bikes with gear pumps enough.

Triumph & Ariel for sure but Norton & Matchless/AJS had gear pumps with the same problem.
Late Commandos had a check valve but still had a gear pump.

Offline BSA_54A10

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Re: Wet sumping
« Reply #29 on: 01.05. 2018 09:48 »
Commandos & Triumphs had piston pumps and wet sumping is as previously mentioned a problem with riders who do not use bikes with gear pumps enough.

Triumph & Ariel for sure but Norton & Matchless/AJS had gear pumps with the same problem.
Late Commandos had a check valve but still had a gear pump.

Looks like I will go back and stand in the naughty corner with the dunces had on yet again.
Thanks for correcting the error.
Bike Beesa
Trevor